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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2004 (April-June) » A phrase... « Previous Next »

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Joe (144.141.194.4 - 144.141.194.4)
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 09:15 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Hello,

I wanted to try and translate this saying that my father used to say all the time:

"Patience is the virtue of the victorious."

I have all the words looked up plus their genitives but I am not sure in what order to put them in.

From what I have read about Irish it would have to written something like this right?

"Is patience the virtue of the victorious."

Joe

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 09:31 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Foighne suailce na mbuach

The "Is" is implied

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 10:43 am:   Edit Post Print Post

And I'm not sure about the eclipse on buach....

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.109.199 - 159.134.109.199)
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 12:39 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A hAonghuis, mo náire thú! Riail Ghramadaí Shimplí atá inti!!

An buach -> Suailce an bhuaigh

Na buaigh -> Suailce na mbuach

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.109.199 - 159.134.109.199)
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2004 - 12:41 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

There's a fada in there:

Foighne Suáilce na mBuach

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.102.23 - 159.134.102.23)
Posted on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 05:14 am:   Edit Post Print Post

That's got me thinking. I wonder what's the purpose of sticking it the é in sentences like the following?:

Is é Seán an ceannaire.

For instance, I would say:

Seán an ceannaire.

or if I was being really explicit about it I'd say:

Is Seán an ceannaire.

But why the é!?

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 03:21 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A Fhirín na mBróg. Labhraím an teanga seachas leabhar gramadaí na mBráithe Críostaí a bheith faoi mo philiúr chuile oíche. Agus tá fhios agam go dtéann fada ar strae orm ó am go chéile. Ach taimse beagan níos sine na thú fhéin, agus ní chreidim a thuilleadh go bhfuilim uile-eolach. Níl fadhb agam é a admháil nuair atáim éiginte faoi rud éigin. Ní feictear dhom gurbh cúis náire é sin.

Maidir le Is é Seán an ceannaire - tá treisiú i gceist; tá béim a chur ar gurbh é Seán seachas duine ar bith eile atá i gceist.

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 03:40 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Dála an scéal.
An Tuiseal Gairmeach de Aonghus ná "A Aonghuis"

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Joe (144.141.194.4 - 144.141.194.4)
Posted on Sunday, April 11, 2004 - 09:48 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Hello again,

I am just now getting around to this post...I just wanted to say thanks to Aonghus and Fear na mBróg for responding.

But I am not sure I know how to pronounce it; can one of you help me with this?

Also, I just to looking at the words up for Fear na mBróg...are you meaning "man of the shoe" or "shoe man" or maybe "the name Schueman" assuming that's how you spell it?

Joe

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.103.93 - 159.134.103.93)
Posted on Sunday, April 11, 2004 - 12:47 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

An bhróg = The shoe

Na bróga = The shoes

Fear na Bróige = (The) Man of the Shoe / The Shoe's Man

Fear na mBróg = (The) Man of the Shoes / The Shoes man / The Shoes' Man / The Shoe Man

---

A Shoe Shop = Siopa Bróg

A Car Shop = Siopa Carranna

A Bike Shop = Siopa Rothar

A Door Shop = Siopa Doirse

A Cigarette Shop = Siopa Toitíní


It's the Genetive Plural that's used.

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Joe (144.141.194.4 - 144.141.194.4)
Posted on Monday, April 12, 2004 - 01:10 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I just figured it was a creative way of saying your last name without being so direct...

My question still remains on how to pronounce the saying Foighne Suáilce na mBuach...

Joe

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.109.52 - 159.134.109.52)
Posted on Monday, April 12, 2004 - 01:19 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Ní bhaineann sé ar bith le mo shloinne!
It's nothing to do with my last name!

Some people say tomato, some say tomato.

Déarfainnse:
I'd say:

Feye-ne Sue-oil-ce na moo-uck

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Natalie (207.179.161.67 - 207.179.161.67)
Posted on Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 04:25 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I have a question (which has nothing to do with what's being explained right now but I don't like starting my own threads for what is probably a simple question).

I don't understand the idea of putting "a" before a verb in the middle of a sentence. It makes sense to a point in my book and then they throw some other phrase in. I'll understand the meaning of it but not how or why they put it in. I'm using Teach Yourself Irish by Diarmuid Ó Sé so here's an example from that book.

Cén t-am a thosaíonn tú

It gives the explanation that the "a" is almost the equivalent of saying "which" so that sort of makes sense but here's one that doesn't.

Cad a cheapann tú de?
What do you think of him?

But then there's an example like this:

Téim a choladh
I go to sleep (or something along that lines)

That's the sort of example I don't understand. Do you always you "a" when you're putting in a verb in the "infinitif"(possibly not even a word in english; ex: to go, to walk) because I saw another example like that without using the little "a" word.

Anyway, I know I seem to be rambling so in simple terms, can anyone explain to me how to say phrases like:

I go to look at the paintings.

*And as an after thought, could anyone explain to me the use of "a"

Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.103.68 - 159.134.103.68)
Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 03:48 am:   Edit Post Print Post

a

It has many uses. The most obvious being:

a bhata -> his stick
a bata -> her stick
a mbataí -> their sticks

Then we have it meaning "which", "that", "who":

(That is) the man that closed the door
the man who closed the door
the man which closed the door

(Is é sin) an fear a dhún an doras

(That is) the door that the man closed.
(Is é sin) an doras gur dhún an fear.


To close = dúnadh

When it's after a noun, it may become "a dhúnadh":

Dúirt sé liom an doras a dhúnadh.
Dúirt sé liom dúnadh.

Although others may say:

Dúirt sé liom an doras dúnadh.
Dúirt sé liom a dhúnadh.
Téim a chodladh.


"Cad a cheapann tú de?"

I myself would say "Cad a gceapann tú de"? I have changed "go" into "a", abbreviated it. "What do you think of it?", "What is it which you think of it?"


I go to look at the paintings:

Téim chun féachaint ar na pictiúirí (The sole reason why, there's no other reason, ie. "in order to")
Téim le féachaint ar na pictiúirí ( One of the reasons )

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Natalie (207.179.186.150 - 207.179.186.150)
Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 04:02 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Ok, go raibh maith agat. They mentioned the use of these words many times but never really explained them. Thank you for clearing it up.

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Natalie (207.179.186.150 - 207.179.186.150)
Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 04:10 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Ok, I'm sorry, I have another quick question.

it says in the grammar section on this site that when you have the past tense of a word, you just lenite it but leave it generally the way it is. If I understand right (and this is all I'm guessing), that for example, the verbs used in the sample section in the grammar area are just the words you get when you first look them up in a dictionary (but lenited). So my question is why is it:

(That is) the man that closed the door
(Is é sin) an fear a dhún an doras

Is the verb dúnadh here in another form and if so, why?

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.102.53 - 159.134.102.53)
Posted on Friday, April 16, 2004 - 03:06 am:   Edit Post Print Post

a, the one that means "which", causes séimhiú, thus we have:

Is é sin an fear a dhún an doras

But there was a séimhiú(=h=lenition) there already in anyway!
But lets take the present tense:

Dúnann sé an doras
Is é sin an fear a dhúnann an doras

---

Past Tense... you don't leave it generally the way it is... you leave it exactly the way it is. Some verbs:

Dún -> Dhún
Bris -> Bhris
Ceannaigh -> Cheannaigh
Deisigh -> Dheisigh
Codail -> Chodail
Cosain -> Chosain

Words that begin with a vowel:

Ól -> D'ól
Eitil -> D'eitil
Éirigh -> D'éirigh
Athraigh -> D'athraigh

And then there's the ones that begin with F, they get extra-special treatement, they get a séimhiú and a "D'":

Fág -> D'fhág
Fan -> D'fhan
Fiafraigh -> D'fhiafraigh


And that's the past tense!

--


"dúnadh" is a verbal noun. It's a noun that you make out of a verb. For example, take the verb "introduce", now think "The introduction of the Euro". "dúnadh" = "closure".

Chonaic mé briseadh na fuinneoige
I saw the breaking of the window

Chonaic mé dúnadh an dorais
I saw the closing(closure) of the door


Another use for the verbal noun:

I like to close the door: Is maith liom an doras a dhúnadh. (It goes after the noun, which usually means at the end of the sentence, but not necessarily):

Is maith liom an doras a dhúnadh gach maidin.

(1 Syllable)
Dún -> Dúnadh
Bris -> Briseadh

(2 Syllables, with "igh")
Deisigh -> Deisiú
Bailigh -> Bailiú

(2 Syllables, without "igh", commonly referred to as "concertina verbs")

Cosain -> Cosaint
Eitil -> Eitilt


And now another use for the verbal noun:

I am cleaning my room: Tá mé ag glanadh mo sheomra


---


Ask as many questions as you like, I enjoy helping(verbal noun)!


Mise le meas

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Natalie (142.166.247.145 - 142.166.247.145)
Posted on Friday, April 16, 2004 - 03:02 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Thank you (again). I didn't know that was a verbal noun. I could've looked it up I suppose but I find its easier to ask, because I get a detailed explanation. Thank you for explaining all that to me.

( I'll probably have more quesitons soon. :) )

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Fear na mBróg (159.134.100.162 - 159.134.100.162)
Posted on Saturday, April 17, 2004 - 03:21 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Tá an-fháilte romhat!

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