Hello, I'd like to know wether it is possible to make a difference between some sentences, with an example :

You may say "Tá an bhean óg"

or, I think : "tá an bhean láidir óg"

but how could you indicate the difference between
" the strong woman is young" and " the woman is strong and young"?

thank you!!

In writing, you can't make a difference. In speech there is a difference, there's a slight pausa at the end of the subject, I'd say.

I don't think I'd ever say "tá | an bhean | láidir óg." You might say, "tá | an bhean | óg agus láidir," or "is | bean óg láidir | í"... But you wouldn't combine two adjectives predicatively like that with the substantive verb, I don't think...

Pairs of adjectives do go together: tinn tuirseach, tuirseach traochta, te bruite, breá brothallach, ... srl. The word "agus" is not used between them. Ara nach raibh mé "aosta pósta" faoin am sin. (i.e. "grown up and married")

As for distinguishing between "the strong woman is young" and "the woman is strong and young" you could say "An bhean láidir tá sí óg." and then "Bean óg láidir í." (= Bean óg láidir is ea í [sin]) You could repeat the verb: An bhean sin tá sí óg agus tá sí láidir. etc.

I can just about remember Peig's description of her teacher, "go raibh sí cumtha córach" (shapely). No "agus".

Yeah, you're right, you could say, "tá | mé | tinn tuirseach de," but "tá | an bhean | láidir óg" just doesn't sound right...

I think it's interesting that you often see two adjectives paired together that begin with the same letter, for example, tinn tuirseach. They have a nice sound when paired like that, almost sing-song in nature. I was told once that there are plenty of these pairs of adjectives and that it's a trait of the Irish language. Is that true?

A Rothaí, tá cuid mhór acu ann cinnte. Adjectives and adverbs/adverbial phrases - alliterative, such as "slán sábháilte", "tinn tuirseach","go mion minic", "go sona sásta" - and rhyming, such as "aosta pósta", "i ndáiríre píre"... Níl ach dornán beag acu ar eolas agam féin. Has anyone a list of them? (Maybe Aonghus, ach bíonn sé ina thost le linn an Charghais).

There are many of them in 'Diolaim abairti duchasacha'.

I don't see anything wrong with "Tá an bhean láidir óg" other than the fact that it sounds a bit awkward/unusual as a statement even in English.

I don't see any real structural difference between it and "Tá an buachaill óg caillte" or "Tá an seanfhear bacach". (lame)

There's nothing wrong indeed, the question was:

quote:

but how could you indicate the difference between
" the strong woman is young" and " the woman is strong and young"?

An féidir leat rá rud éigin ar nós:

Tá an bhean láidir ina hóige

nó- Is óige ar an mbean láidir

nó -óg is ea an bhean láidir

(Gabh mo leithscéal má tháid san mícheart, táim ag foghlaim fós)

These look wrong to me:

nó- Is óige ar an mbean láidir
-> as far as I know you can't use abstract nouns in this way.

nó -óg is ea an bhean láidir
-> I've never seen the pattern "X is ea + subject" used with an adjective (but I may be wrong)

Who said "Not for the sake of "is" and "tá" did we join Conradh na Gaeilge"? Pádraig Mac Piarais? That's only the jist of it but one thing you've got to clarify for yourself in Irish is the different uses of "is" and "tá". Both correspond to "is" in English but are used differently. This is "the" big issue in Irish.

Here's a most unstudied unscientific observation:
Use "tá" with attributive adjectives: Tá an bhean >>> óg = Tá an bhean óg... The woman is young.
Use "is" with nouns: Is bean óg í an bhean sin thall.. That woman over there is a young woman.

A study of the grammar and use of "is" and "tá" will reveal answers to many of the questions (and errors) on this thread.

Lughaidh, my last post followed a discussion about pairing of adjectives. I know what the original question was.

the strong woman is young - tá an bhean láidir óg

the woman is strong and young - tá an bhean láidir agus óg


No difficulty there as far as I can see.

Hello, I wonder if it is possible to say

"Is marbh éan an chait é" with a noun complement to say
"The cat's bird is dead"

You may say "Is marbh éan an chait". No need of "é", as far as I know.
But it's more common to say "Ta éan an chait marbh".

My attempt at divining a rule for is and tá above has fallen at the first post: "Is marbh éan an chait." is possible just as "Is breá an lá é" (It is a fine day) is possible instead of "Tá an lá [go] breá. I'll have to think again.

"Is marbh éan an chait" ("The cat's bird is dead") taken out of context, Hugo75, could be misinterpreted in speech: "is mhairbh éan an cat" meaning "and a bird killed the cat." Only two letters have moved! :-)

I'd prefer Lughaidh's version "Tá éan an chait marbh."

and why don't we say "is marbh éan an chait é" if we say "is bréa an lá é"?
is it just common to make the sentence lighter?

quote:

and why don't we say "is marbh éan an chait é" if we say "is bréa an lá é"?
is it just common to make the sentence lighter?

Basically,
"Is brea an la é" is synonym to "Is la brea é". (it is a beautiful day).

but would you say that "is marbh éan an chait é" is synonym to "is éan marbh an chait é"? (it is the cat's dead bird).
Sounds strange.

In "Is la brea é", "la brea" is indefinite. Maybe that's why there's a difference.

I'd say you can't use the pattern "is + adj + an + noun + é/i/iad" with noun groups with noun + definite noun in the genitive.

FFor instance I don't think you could say "Is deas teach Sheain é". But you may say "Is deas teach Sheain", I think.

Tá teach Sheáin [go] deas.
Is deas an teach é, teach Sheáin.

quote:

but how could you indicate the difference between
" the strong woman is young" and " the woman is strong and young"?

Keep it simple. If they don't seem suitable, say something else, or state it so the meaning is understood, like Lughaidh said, insert a pause.

The strong woman is young.

Tá an bhean láidir óg.
Is óg í an bhean láidir.

The woman is strong and young.

Tá an bhean láidir agus óg.
Is láidir agus óg í an bhean.