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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 2005- » 2009 (September-October) » Archive through September 24, 2009 » Cad faoi "ea"? « Previous Next »

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Acco
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Username: Acco

Post Number: 36
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:08 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

A chairde, could you give me the rundown about "ea"?

I know that "Is fear é" means "He's a man" and " Fear is ea é" is "He's a man (i.e. not a woman, for example).

What is the difference between "Más ea" and "Más é" and "Is fíor sin, nach ea" and "Is fíor sin, nach é"? (Maybe some of those expressions might not be used.)

And what is correct: "Nach ea" or "Nach é"?

What about the sanasaíocht of "ea"?

Does it mean "it"?

GRMA.

(Message edited by acco on September 19, 2009)

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Lughaidh
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Username: Lughaidh

Post Number: 3197
Registered: 01-2005


Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 01:33 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Yeah, ea was "eadh" before the 1950s and it corresponds to Latin "id" and to English "it", ie. it's the old neuter pronoun. Now it is only used with the copula, when speaking about indefinite things.

Ex:
An múinteoir é? - Is ea.
An é an múinteoir é? - Is é.

Learn Irish pronunciation here: http://loig.cheveau.ifrance.com/irish/irishsounds/irishsounds.html & http://fsii.gaeilge.org/

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Seánw
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Username: Seánw

Post Number: 113
Registered: 07-2009


Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 04:20 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Is fear é agus Fear is ea é

The second structure is common in Munster and Connacht. They are equivalent.

(Message edited by seánw on September 19, 2009)

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Taidhgín
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Username: Taidhgín

Post Number: 483
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 01:03 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Acco, I can't give any linquistic terminology nor even the history of the word but here's my understanding of it:

An tusa an Acco scríobhann ar fhóram Daltaí? (Are you the Acco who writes on the Daltaí forum?)
Is ea! Is mé! (It is so. It is I.)

Céard é sin? Ainmhí, an ea? (What is that? An animal, is it?)
Ní hea. Is dealbh é. (No = It is not so. It is a statue.)

"ea" is a pronoun that can stand for masculine feminine or something already said.

Is it also used in sentences like this:
An fear sin thall, iascaire is ea é. (That man over there, he is a fisherman.)

If you learn all you can find about An Chopail / The Copula you will see how "ea" is used. I'm sure Ó Dónaill has lots of examples.

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Lars
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Username: Lars

Post Number: 422
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 02:09 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

ea = it, a remnant of neuter gender.

Fear is ea é = very literally "man is it he", less literally "A man: he is it", i.e. He is a man

Lars

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Pádraig
Member
Username: Pádraig

Post Number: 832
Registered: 09-2004


Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 05:59 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

While y'aller about it, can anyone simply explain when é is repeated in sentences with the copula?

Mar sampla: Is fear é vs. Is Seán é fear é. I'm guessing one of these is incorrect, but I don't know which or why.

Is ait an mac an saol agus fáilte roimh cheartúcháin.

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 8839
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 05:27 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

The second.

Is fear é
Is * a man * he
verb * subject * object

The second should be:
Is fear Séan
Is * a man * Seán
verb subject object

or
Is é Seán an fear
*is * he * seán * the man
(As is, the right man for the job. In this case, "é" is emphasising Seán)

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Lars
Member
Username: Lars

Post Number: 423
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 10:40 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

"É" isn't repeated, actually.
There are two different kinds of "é":

Is é an fear é = He is the man.
- First é: Necessary because it is impossibile to put a definite noun next to the copula
(never ever: Is an fear ...; Is Seán ...; Is m'athair ...; etc.)
This é isn't subject, it is a so-called "subpredicate" (fofhaisnéis). So it s part of the predicate ("é an fear" is the whole predicate)
- Second é: That's the subject "he".
quote:

Is Seán é fear é


That's impossible.
Is fear é Seán = Séan is a man (é here is a "sub-subject", fo-ainmní. It isn't really necessary.
Is fear Seán would be OK, too.
Is é Seán an fear = Seán is the man (é here subpredicate again though Seán is subject)
quote:

Is fear é
Is * a man * he
verb * subject * object


Rather:
copula * predicate * subject
(There's no object in copula clauses)

Lars

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 8844
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 11:05 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Géillim dod eolas, a Mháistir! GRMA! Bhí fhios agam gur ar oighear thanaí a bhí mise ag dul i ngleic le gramadach!

(A t-aon scrúdú scoile ar theip mé riamh ann - scrúdú Béarla agus mé san Ostair. Bhíos i rang 6 ag an am. Níor thuig mé na téarmaí gramadaí a bhí ar mo chomhghleacaithe thall dul i ngleic leo. Ní gá a rá gurbh mór an spóirt dóibh siúd é!)



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