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Taig (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 02:46 pm: |
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Is anyone familiar with a story about Daniel O'Connell and how an Irish-speaking servant girl saves his life? I have seen several versions of the tale in which the girl Kate asks O'Connell (in Irish), "Daniel O'Connell, do you speak Irish? There is enough poison on your plate to kill hundreds. I hear your story, girl, and I will deal with the English churl." So the Irish language saved Daniel O'Connell's life. This rural legend seems at odds with the conventional wisdom about O'Connell's view of the language as a hindrance to be discarded. (A fragment of the story in Ulster Irish: "Dónall Ó Conaill - a bhfuil agat Gaeilic? Tá ... do phláta agus marbhadh na céadtaibh." "A chailín .... do scéala, a Cháiti, agus deasóchaidh mise le bodach a' Bhéarla é!") |
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Abigail
Member Username: Abigail
Post Number: 943 Registered: 06-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 01:13 am: |
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This may be because the conventional wisdom is (partly) based on stuff he actually said! Laoch béaloidis a rinneadh den "immortal Dan" i ndiaidh a bháis, agus is iomaí scéal a d'insítí ina thaobh go dtí le fíordhéanaí. Scríobh Ríonach Uí Ógáin leabhar maith ina gcíortar a leithéid seo. (Tiocfaidh ainm an leabhair chugam am ar bith anois... tá sé ar an tseilf agam sa mbaile...) Tá fáilte roimh chuile cheartú!
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Abigail
Member Username: Abigail
Post Number: 944 Registered: 06-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 01:43 am: |
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quote:Tiocfaidh ainm an leabhair chugam am ar bith anois... tá sé ar an tseilf agam sa mbaile... "An Rí gan Choróin" atá air. Tá fáilte roimh chuile cheartú!
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 7851 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 06:42 am: |
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He would have been a fluent Irish speaker, given where he came from. But he did think Irish should be dropped. There is a story which sort of bookends the decline of Irish. O'Connell addressing a meeting in English (in Ennis, I think) and no-one understanding him. Then a century or so later, in the same place, Dev addressing a meeting in Irish to equal incomprehension. The servant girl using an Irish riddle (ól fuar agus té[ith]) to save a hero occurs in other places also. |
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(Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 06:29 am: |
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- "A Dhomhnaill Uí Chonaill", a deir sí, "an dtuigfeá-sa Gaedhilge?" - "Thuigfinn, a chailín", a deir sé, "nó céard sin is léar duit?" - "Tá rud ar do chupán a mharódh na céadta. Is múch an solas is cuir thart é, má fhéadair." - "Más fíor sin, a chailín", a deir sé, "is maith í do spréidh-se". |
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 4343 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 12:58 pm: |
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Sa leagan a chuala mé i bhfad ó shin thug an cailín aimsire an rabhadh mar véarsa d'amhrán. An bhfuil an leagan sin ag éinne anseo? "An seanchas gearr, an seanchas is fearr."
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Curiousfinn
Member Username: Curiousfinn
Post Number: 157 Registered: 08-2008
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 07:42 pm: |
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ól fuar agus té[ith] Do I get this right, this has two meanings, one about eating té and one about fleeing? Tine, siúil liom!
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Dahtet
Member Username: Dahtet
Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2008
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 07:54 pm: |
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http://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%B3nall_%C3%93_Conaill Tá alt maith ag an Vicipéid faoi agus tá an scéal seo ann (féach ar 'Scéal tipiciúil béaloidis faoin gConallach agus an Ghaeilge'). |
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 4345 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 07:56 pm: |
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Seo mar a ríomhtar an scéal san alt ar Vicipéid. http://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dónall_Ó_Conaill Bheadh sé an-éasca na habairí sa chomhrá gairid sin a chanadh. Fuair Dónall Ó Conaill cuireadh dinnéir i Londain agus cuireadh nimh ina chupán. Ach bhí cailín ó Éirinn ann agus bhí Gaeilge aici. Bhí a fhios aici go raibh an nimh curtha ina chupán agus theastaigh uaithi gaoth an fhocail a thabhairt do Dhónall. Bhí Dónall ann agus é ar chlíothán an bhoird, agus tháinig an cailín agus gach aon ní aici á chur ar an mbord i gcóir an dinnéir; agus bhí stíobhard ag socrú an bhia - a phláta féin agus a chupán féin aige á chur ar a aghaidh amach. Ghabh an cailín isteach agus labhair sí: "A Dhónaill Uí Chonaill, an dtuigeann tú Gaeilge?" "Tuigim go maith í, a chailín ó Éirinn." "Tá nimh i do chupán a mharódh na céadta!" "Maith tú, a chailín, is tabharfaidh mé spré duit." Thóg sé a chupán féin agus chuir sé anonn é go tiubh agus thóg sé cupán eile. Maraíodh fear eile ansin ina ionad féin. "An seanchas gearr, an seanchas is fearr."
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 4346 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 07:58 pm: |
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Bhí tú dhá nóiméad ar thosach orm, a Dahtet. :-) "An seanchas gearr, an seanchas is fearr."
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Danny2007
Member Username: Danny2007
Post Number: 195 Registered: 12-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 08:28 pm: |
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quote:He would have been a fluent Irish speaker, given where he came from. But he did think Irish should be dropped. There is a story which sort of bookends the decline of Irish. O'Connell addressing a meeting in English (in Ennis, I think) and no-one understanding him. Then a century or so later, in the same place, Dev addressing a meeting in Irish to equal incomprehension. It was actually in Clifden in west Galway, according to Alan Titley. O'Connell was a native speaker and built up a successful law practice, partly owing to his full bilingualism. Asked about the decline of Irish amongst the peasantry he said: "... although the Irish language is connected with many recollections which twine round the hearts of Irishmen, yet the superior utility of the English tongue as a medium of all modern communication is so great that I can witness without a sigh the gradual disuse of Irish." This is briefly covered in Tony Crowley's fantastic book entitled "The Politics of Language in Ireland 1366-1922: A Sourcebook" (Routledge, 1999) http://www.routledgepolitics.com/books/The-Politics-of-Language-in-Ireland-1366- 1922-isbn9780415157186 Was it not O'Connell's own aunt Eibhlín Dubh Ní Chonaill who composed the famous Caoineadh Airt Uí Laoghaire/Lament for Art O'Leary? When writing your messages, please use the same courtesy that you would show when speaking face-to-face with someone. - Daltaí.com
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Abigail
Member Username: Abigail
Post Number: 945 Registered: 06-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 09:48 pm: |
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Was it not O'Connell's own aunt Eibhlín Dubh Ní Chonaill who composed the famous Caoineadh Airt Uí Laoghaire/Lament for Art O'Leary? Ba í. Chuir sé sin an t-iontas orm nuair a léigh mé é... is le haois eile ar fad a shamhlaigh mé caoineadh Airt riamh ar chuma eicínt. (ar fad = altogether; ar chuma éigin/eicínt = somehow) Tá fáilte roimh chuile cheartú!
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 4348 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 10:32 pm: |
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Deirtear gur chum sí dán nuair a saolaíodh D.Ó.C. ag tairngreacht sonais in Éirinn dá bharr. Tá cúpla leagan den dán seo ann ar aon nós. Níl a fhios agam an bhfuil aon cheann acu ar fáil ar an idirlíon, ach tá siad ar fáil san irisleabhar Éigse, más maith mo chuimhe. "An seanchas gearr, an seanchas is fearr."
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 4349 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 10:43 pm: |
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quote:ól fuar agus té[ith] Do I get this right, this has two meanings...? Thuig tú i gceart é! Dála an scéil, níl síneadh fada i gceachtar den dá fhocal: te, teith. "An seanchas gearr, an seanchas is fearr."
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Trigger
Member Username: Trigger
Post Number: 277 Registered: 10-2007
| Posted on Thursday, January 08, 2009 - 04:43 am: |
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Talking about Clifen being the capital of Conamara, do very old people still communicate in Irish together? It seems strange that Irish has died out, is there any speakers left there? Gaeilge go deo!
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