There is a profession in the US known as a Physician Assistant. This is a practioner of medicine who practices with limited autonomy under the direct ( or indirect) supervision of a licensed physician. We've been using them in uderserved areas of the US for nearly 30 years. They have proven themselves to be competent and highly cost effective. Canada has begun to use them, Denmark (I believe) has begun a formal training program to create their own version and there is a pilot program in the UK. At my last Emergency Medicine conference there was mention made of Ireland beginning to take a look at this profession as a means of delivering cost efficient healthcare to underserved, rural areas. So...that begs two questions from me:

One: What would be an appropriate Irish word to represent this profession. B'fhéidir, Giolla Lia?

Two: Since they will be most likley utilized in rural regions, should they not be required to have fluent Irish?

"Cúntóir lia", is dócha. ("Giolla" is a rather demeaning word.)

A James,

Go raibh maith agat don cheist. Tá an chlár seo ag mo hollscoil. Tréimhse an-spreagúil í seo don ollscoil anseo i Quinnipiac. Feic www.quinnipiac.edu. Tá cláir eile ag UC Cork agus Trinity Coláiste. Is mian liom a bí ar an eolas faoi seo freisin.)

(Thanks for the question, James. This program is at my university. These are exciting times at Quinnipiac. See www.quinnipiac.edu. We have other programs at UC Cork and Tinity College. I want to know about this also.)

quote:

One: What would be an appropriate Irish word to represent this profession. B'fhéidir, Giolla Lia?

Unlike English, Irish still calls an "Assistant Physician" a "Physician" rather than an "Assistant", but uses a simple adjective to convery that they're an assitant:

assistant cameraman = ceamaradóir cúnta
assistant director = stiúrthóir cúnta
assistant editor = eagarthóir cúnta
assistant hairdresser = gruagaire cúnta
assistant librarian = leabharlannaí cúnta
assistant make-up artist = smideoir cúnta

Therefore, I'd translate "Assistant Physician" as: Lia Cúnta

quote:

Two: Since they will be most likley utilized in rural regions, should they not be required to have fluent Irish?

If rural regions only spoke Irish and not English, then I'd tend to agree with you. However, even in the small pockets of Ireland that speak Irish, the people still can speak English. An Assistant Physician shouldn't be burdeoned with having to learn a second language which they'll make little to no use of. It'd make far more sense for them to learn Polish instead.

Anyhow, in the medical profession, everything's latin as far as I know (e.g. cardiac unit Vs heart unit).

Correct, medicine is mostly a Latin based profession. My questions were prompted by my understanding of the Language Act and my experience with patients with limited english.

As I understand the Language Act, all of the legislation that will be enacted to govern this profession must be written in Irish as well as english. I was curious as to an accurate and correct translation, one that would convey the concept of a PA as a colleague. Seems Cúnta does that better than Giolla. Secondly, as I understand the Language Act, if an Irish person wishes to receive services as gaeilge, then he/she has that right. Although they may speak english, if they are more comfortable with Irish, then shouldn't they be able to receive their healthcare services as gaeilge?

That last was not meant to antagonize, but to stimulate discussion and is driven by my experience with Spanish speaking patients with limited english. But, your point is well taken. Most (if not all) rural Irishmen/women speak fluent english. The days of the monoglot gaeilgoir are long gone, I suppose.

quote:

assistant cameraman = ceamaradóir cúnta
assistant director = stiúrthóir cúnta
assistant editor = eagarthóir cúnta
[etc.]

Therefore, I'd translate "Assistant Physician" as: Lia Cúnta

Ní aontaím leat, a Fhear. Is eagarthóirí iad an t-eagarthóir agus an t-eagarthóir cúnta araon. Tá duine acu níos airde/níos cumhachtaí ná an duine eile, sin an méid. Ach ní lia é an p.a.. Cabhraíonn sé/sí leis an lia, ach ní M.D. é/í.

Fuair mé an méid seo ó http://www.acmhainn.ie/ :

dental assistant = cúntóir déidliachta

Má leantar leis an múnla sin, "cúntóir liachta" an téarma ceart.

Maith dom as Béarla a úsáid ann seo a leanas ach tá stór focal in easnamh orm:

I mBéarla, I would draw a distinction idir "assistant dentist" and "a dentist's assistant". Más "a physician's assitant" atá i gceist, ansin "cúntóir lia" a bheadh oiriúnach. Ach más "assitant physician" atá i gceist, mholfainn "lia cúnta".

Maidir le "Is an assistant physician a physician or are they just an assistant that helps the physician by bringing him cups of coffee", níl a fhios agam.

Má deir tú "cúntóir lia", ceapaim go bhfuil tú ag rá nach lia atá i gceist ar chor ar bith (seans go drochbhéasach).

(Message edited by Fear_na_mBróg on January 20, 2007)

An Ghaeilge ar dtús.

I would a distinction idir "assistant dentist" and...

Dhéanfainn idirdhealú ar X agus Y.

Tuigim. De réir mar a thuigim é, seasann an p.a. áit éigin idir an (bhan)altra" agus an "lia" maidir leis na cáilíochtaí atá aici/aige. Is gairm ar leith í. Tá an focal "leasuachtarán" againn. B'fhéidir gur "leaslia" é an p.a. ??

This is probably more information than you need, but it should clarify the term "assistant".

a PA is definitely NOT someone who fetches the doctor's coffee!!!

http://www.aapa.org/geninfo1.html

"Cúntóir liachta" = helper of-practice-of-medicine

I bhfocail eile (in other words), tá feidhm ar leith acu sa liacht (they have a distinct function/roll in the practice of medicine). An bhfuil an ceart agam, James?

As Béal Dhennis:

quote:

Tuigim. De réir mar a thuigim é, seasann an p.a. áit éigin idir an (bhan)altra" agus an "lia" maidir leis na cáilíochtaí atá aici/aige. Is gairm ar leith í. Tá an focal "leasuachtarán" againn. B'fhéidir gur "leaslia" é an p.a. ??

(Is fearr liom an focal "altra" a úsáid in ionad "banaltra". Fiú agus mé ag labhairt Béarla, níl maith liom focal mar "actress" a úsáid in ionad "actor". Ach sin scéal eile!)

Sí mo thuiscint gurb ionann "leas" sa Ghaeilge agus "vice" sa Bhéarla:

vice-president = leasuachtarán

Má táimid ag iarraidh téarma nua a chumadh ar son "assistant physician", caithfimid réiteach cad atá ann? An é:

(1) Duine a thuilleann $5 ar feadh na huaire ag fáil chaife an lia. As Béarla, thabharfainn "a physician's assistant" air seo seachas "assistant physician".
(2) Duine a bhfuil oilteacht leighis aige a dhéanann rudaí mar fhuil a thógáil ó dhaoine, ach níl siad chomh ard le lia.

Ceapaim go bhfuil "lia cúnta" oiriúinach don dara ceann, nach bhfuil?

Tá... Tá tú ceart.

It is important that medical services be available in Irish. This is where the schemes which bodies such as teh Health Services Executive agree with the Minister come in.

Patients with dementia may no longer be able to communicate in English, but can in Irish, for example.

Not to mention the correct diagnosis of learning difficulties in children whose first language is Irish.

http://www.coimisineir.ie/downloads/Scim_-_HSE_West.pdf

(The document is bilingual)

quote:

Dochtúirí Teaghlaigh sa Ghaeltacht

Tuigeann FSS Iarthar go bhfuil dualgas ar leith air go mbeidh teacht ar sheirbhísí iomlán agus cuimsitheach Dochtúireachta Teaghlaigh trí Ghaeilge sa Ghaeltacht agus geallann sé , ó thus na scéime seo, eolas cruinn a chuir ar fáil maidir le rochtain agus leibhéal na seirbhísí seo trí Ghaeilge, san áit is giorra dóibh. Beidh an t-eolas seo ar fáil ach iarratas a dhéanamh chuig an Oifig Réigiúnach, FSS, Gaillimh.
Tabharfar gach deis do dhochtúirí atá ag obair sa Ghaeltacht, líofacht Ghaeilge a bhaint amach , le go mbeidh ar a gcumas tuilleadh seirbhísí trí Ghaeilge a chur ar fáil, thar thréimhse feidhme na scéime seo

...

De bhrí go gcuireannr an FSS seirbhísí ar fáil lá agus oíche – seirbhísí éigeandála ‘srl ní féidir a chinntiú go mbeidh seirbhís trí Ghaeilge ar fáil de bharr a laghad foirne le Gaeilge líofa atá againn. Cuireann altraí agus baill foirne eile ón nGaeltacht agus cainteoirí Gaeilge eile, seirbhís trí Ghaeilge ar fáil san aonad A&E agus ar na bardaí

quote:

4.9 Teiripé Teanga
Glacann an FSS leis nár chóir go mbeadh ar dhaoine dul i ngleic lena ndeacrachtaí urlabhra in aon teanga seachas a dteanga dúchais.

Tá mé díreach tar éis an cheist seo a chur faoi bhráid na saineolaithe ag achmainn.ie. Ag fanacht lena bhfreagraí atá mé anois.

(Having queried them, I'm waiting for the experts at acmhainn to give their opinion.)

Seo an freagra a fuair mé ar maidin:

Cúntóir Liachta. Beadh Lia Cúnta cáilithe mar dhoctúir, ach ag tabhairt cúnamh do dhoctúir eile.

quote:

Cúntóir Liachta. Beadh Lia Cúnta cáilithe mar dhoctúir, ach ag tabhairt cúnamh do dhoctúir eile.

Ag glacadh le comhairle na ndaoine a úsáideann "beadh" in ionad "bheadh", agus "cúnamh" in ionad "cúnaimh"?

Mura bhfuil dul amú orm, is atá i "assistant physician" ná duine a bhfuil oilteacht leighis acu -- mar sin ní cóir "assistant" a thabhairt orthu. "Lia Cúnta" a bheadh agamsa.

Unfortunately there is not really much chance of making a rule that all physicians or their assistants must be fluent speakers of Gaeilge. But maybe a rule could be made that anyone working in the Fior Gaeltacht must have fluent Gaeilge.

Beir bua agus beannacht