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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2003 (April-June) » I'm gonna feel stupid after asking this. « Previous Next »

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Maidhc Ó G. (65.128.208.62 - 65.128.208.62)
Posted on Sunday, April 13, 2003 - 10:44 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Dia daoibh, a chairde,
Can someone give me a fresher upper on the usage of the verbal noun "bheith". Ó Siadhail only gives mention to it in the glossary stating that it is a verbal noun, but gives no example towards its use and the example in my dictionary is fragmented at best.
OK guys, let the banging of erasers on my head begin. (What? Yous've never done that to noone before? hahahaha.)
Go raibh maith agaibh roimh ré.
Slán,
Maidhc.

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Phil (159.134.209.197 - 159.134.209.197)
Posted on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 07:10 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Some sample verbs
-----------------

dún = close
mill = destroy
can = sing

bunaigh = found (found a monastery)
deisigh = fix, repair

And their verbal nouns
------------------------

dúnadh = closure ( The closure of the case)
milleadh = destruction ( The destruction of the window )
canadh = singing ( The singing of the song )

bunú = founding ( The founding of the monastery )
deisiú = repair ( The repairs to the car were done )


You use them for orders too.


Dún an doras

Close the door

Dúirt sé liom an doras a dhúnadh.

He told me to close the door.

-

Beith
-----

Bí ciúin.

Be quiet.

Dúirt sé liom a bheith ciúin.

He told me to be quiet.


As for the actual noun, "being", I've never seen it used but I'll give it a try.

We were afraid of Seán's being out. ( It even sounds weird in English!! )
Bhí eagla orainn roimh bheith Sheáin amach.

Another thing

Bhí mé ag dúnadh an dorais.
I was closing the door.

You never use "ag beith", simply because you don't have too.

I'm funny.

Bíonn mé greanmhar.

I'm being funny.

Tá mé greanmhar.


-Phil

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Maidhc Ó G. (65.128.200.3 - 65.128.200.3)
Posted on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 09:35 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A Phil, a chara,
Go raibh míle maith agat. I think I see it more clearly now. So, say, might - Bhí mé a bheith tinn. I was being sick.> I was sick. - be incorrect? ( I normally would say, "Bhí tinneas orm." for this, but this was close to the fragmented example in my dictionary.)
Also interesting. Around these parts, I've heard plenty of phrases such as, "I thought his being there might stir up some trouble."
Many thanks again.
Slán,
Maidhc.

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Aonghus (193.120.237.66 - 193.120.237.66)
Posted on Monday, April 14, 2003 - 11:11 am:   Edit Post Print Post

We were afraid of Seán's being out. ( It even sounds weird in English!! )
Bhí eagla orainn roimh Shéain a bheith amuigh

"I thought his being there might stir up some trouble."
Cheapas go dtarraingeoidh a bheith ann roinnt achrann

I was being sick
Bhí mé ag cur amach (if you meaning vomiting)
Otherwise, I see no difference in English between I was sick, and I was being sick
Bhí mé tinn
or
Bhí tinneas orm
I would take the latter to mean a specific ache or pain, and the former to mean you were sick

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Phil (159.134.209.233 - 159.134.209.233)
Posted on Tuesday, April 15, 2003 - 03:09 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Bhí mé ag beith tinn

That's a definite NO NO. If you want proof, look at this:

Bhí mé ag bualadh an bhuachalla.

I was hitting the boy

But "buachalla" doesn't mean "boy", it means "of boy". "buachaill" = "boy". The genetive case of the noun follows the verbal noun.

Bhí mé ag beith tinn

Okay so we just get the genetive of "tinn", but then opps, "tinn" isn't a noun, and so, no genetive case. There's just ONE reason why it isn't used.


Once you start to understand the verbal noun, you'll get this stuff dead easy.

Here's a little test for you:

scrúdaigh = examine (the verb)

scrúdú = the noun

But what does scrúdú mean?

a) examination

b) exam

If you can answer that straight away you know what you're doing.

If not here's my attempt at an explantion:

The verbal noun doesn't refer to an object, it refers to the PROCESS.

I was examining the boy

Bhí mé ag scrúdú an bhuachalla.

Literally, that Gaeilge there means "I was at the ____ of the boy", where "examination" is the process.

Hope that clears things up a bit

Just to cement that a little:

introduce -> introduction (The introduction of the boy)

break -> breaking (The breaking of the window)


See how in English there's no proper way to get the verbal noun; Alot of the time we just stick "ing" on the end, which suffices some times, but is confusing at other times. Here's an example:

The verb "go"

I went on holidays.

When you go to the airport, you don't see a big sign saying "Goings", you see "Departures", and why, because "goings" sounds stupid, and why, because there's no proper way to get the verbal noun in english, and why, because english is gay.

While I'm on a role here (allegedly), I'll show you how to get the verbal noun:

Three types of verb:

Dún ( 1 sound )

Cruinnigh ( 2 sounds )

Cosain ( 2 sounds, but DOESN'T end in "igh" )

-

Dún -> dunadh (Stick 'adh' on the end)

Cruinnigh -> cruinniú ( Get rid of 'igh' and stick 'ú' onto it)

Cosain -> cosaint ( most of these verbs get a 't' at the end )

There's irregulars but you learn them dead quick. Well really they're not irregular, they have their own groups.

-

'adh' or 'eadh'

dún -> dúnadh
bris -> briseadh
glan -> glanadh
spreag -> spreagadh

'ú' or 'iú'

bailigh -> bailiú
deisigh -> deisiú
ceartaigh -> ceartú

't' (usually)

cosain -> cosaint
agair -> agairt


And here's a few well know irregulars:

tóg -> tógáil
bain -> baint
ionsaigh -> ionsaí
ceannaigh -> ceannach
réitigh -> réiteach
dúisigh -> dúiseacht
ceangail -> ceangal
léim -> léim
rith -> rith
snámh -> snámh


BTW, to Aonghus, good one on those examples.

-Phil

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Maidhc Ó G. (65.128.208.119 - 65.128.208.119)
Posted on Tuesday, April 15, 2003 - 04:49 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Wow, that's a lot to soak in (Or maybe not.), I sure do appreciate the help Phil an Aonghus. Right, you can't be at the 'being of sick' or 'sickness' for that matter.
I'm seeing now how these may be used in order to go between 'I did something.' and 'I was doing something.'
Shcrúdaigh mé an bhuachaill ar deich ó chlóg. - I examined the boy at 10 o'clock.(When? How many times or often?) vs. Ar 10 ó chlóg, bhí mé ag scrúdú an bhuachaill. - At 10 o'clock, I was examining the boy. (Probably a one time event.)- or - Bhíonn mé ag scrúdú an bhuachaill ar gach lá amháin ar deich ó chlóg. I was examing the boy every day at 10 o' clock. Am I even getting warm?
Go raibh maith agaibh, arís.
Madhc.

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Phil (159.134.209.57 - 159.134.209.57)
Posted on Wednesday, April 16, 2003 - 01:30 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I examined the boy at 10 o'clock

Scrúdaigh mé an buachaill ar a deich a chlog.

(You can't put a 'h' on an 'sc' simply because you can't pronounce it. Nor can you stick fadas wherever you want, lol, only buzzin')

At 10 o'clock, I was examining the boy

Ar a deich a chlog, bhí mé ag scrúdú an buachalla

(Note how it's "buachalla" and not "buachaill". I'm not sure if you put a 'h' on it, but because "buachaill" is masculine, I'm guessing no)

-

The usage of "I was being stupid, I was being funny" in English came about because of one specific reason:

We only have one present tense.

Tá mé greanmhar
Bíonn mé greannmhar

The English for the two of them is:

I am funny
I am funny

So we came up with a new way of doing it:

I am being funny


Or simply, to avoid that, you can say "I was acting funny" "I was behaving funny(ily)"

-Phil

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Maidhc Ó G (65.128.200.235 - 65.128.200.235)
Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 09:49 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Gotcha, 'bauchalla' hahaha gen. case. (Sure, Mike concentrate on one thing and blow a brain fart on two more! hahaha. Ó chlóg -Wha?!) hahaha.
-'preciate the help Phil, t'anx.
HAHAHA! Tá Maidhc ag tosaigh a bheith pian ar toin Phil. (Unintentionally, I assure you.)
Go raibh maith agat.
Slán,
Maidhc.

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Maidhc Ó G (65.129.68.20 - 65.129.68.20)
Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 10:12 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Ag tosú - DARN! I hate when I think right and "correct" myself!
Maidhc.

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Phil (159.134.209.253 - 159.134.209.253)
Posted on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 02:22 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

lol, it's all good.

-Phil

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