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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2000 (January-June) » Gaelic? Irish! « Previous Next »

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Dennis King (donncha.ndip.eskimo.net - 207.54.13.247)
Posted on Monday, February 28, 2000 - 10:25 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I've noticed recently that most people posting to this forum with questions have referred to our language as "Gaelic", which seems to be very common usage in America. In Ireland, and among Irish-speakers, the preferred term in English is "Irish". In any case, saying "Gaelic" risks confusion with Scottish Gaelic. If you go to Borders and buy "Teach Yourself Gaelic", you will be the proud owner of a Scottish Gaelic Textbook. If you want Irish, look for "Teach Yourself Irish" or "Learning Irish" or "Collins Gem Irish Dictionary", etc. etc. etc. Saying "Gaelic" is not offensive, but saying "Irish" is better.

Go raibh maith agaibh!

Dennis King - Stair an Fhocail: suigh
http://www.eskimo.com/~donncha/stair3.html

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Seosamh
Posted on Tuesday, February 29, 2000 - 12:48 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Actually "Gaelic" can sometimes be offensive. Some Americans (and others) have surprisingly strong prejudices against the language and almost always refer to it as "Gaelic".

This is what Máirtín Ó Murchú says in _The Irish Language_ (Dublin, 1985): "In Ireland the word Gaelic, which derives from the native term, has a distinctly pejorative connotation ... its use being intended to imply that the language is of peripheral status in present day Ireland."

Recently people in certain quarters that are opposed to Irish, have updated the approach and have been referring to the language (in English) as "Gaeilge". That implies a respect for the language that they do not, in fact, have.

I hear "Gaelic" from mostly older Irish people, who normally do not know it. And I've heard some people who do have Irish, refer to it as "Gaelic" in a kind of folksy and affectionate way.

But "Irish" is more precise and describes the language's role as the national language. It is also not the invention of rabid Irish Nationalists, as is commonly believed in America: English-speakers called it "Irish" centuries ago and the use of "Gaelic" seems to be comparatively recent.

Sin mar atá. Seosamh

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Sáfach
Posted on Tuesday, February 29, 2000 - 07:02 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I've posted this correction on a message board several times, that when speaking English, the language is called Irish, and when mentioned by someone speaking Irish, the language is referred to as Gaeilge.

But I find people can be surprisingly thick about it.

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williamfuller (1cust140.tnt1.ruston.la.da.uu.net - 63.11.21.140)
Posted on Wednesday, March 01, 2000 - 09:27 am:   Edit Post Print Post

The English seem to use "Erse" when they mean Irish. Mas e bhur dtoil e: any comment on "Erse"? Hope I got the Irish correct here.

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Máire Ní Ógáin (netcache1.mot.com - 129.188.33.221)
Posted on Wednesday, March 01, 2000 - 12:34 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

The use of the word Erse has long since been given up, probably because none of us had a clue what it meant! It isn't an Irish word and few Irish people would have heard of it.

Seosamh, that's the best sum-up of the differences between the use of 'Irish' and 'Gaelic' I could imagine. Personally, I find the language being called either Gaelic or Gaeilge during an English conversation rather irritating.

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Dennis King (donncha.ndip.eskimo.net - 207.54.13.247)
Posted on Wednesday, March 01, 2000 - 01:48 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

The best use of the word "Erse" was made by Breandán Ó Beacháin when he took the •••• out of "An Fáinne" calling it "The Erse Hole". Mo bharúil féin, ar ndóigh.

(A Dhia na nGrást! I just previewed my message before posting only to find that a common four letter word meaning "mún" had been replaced by four dashes! An seanbhean rialta a chuir an clár plé seo le chéile?!?)

Dennis King

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Seosamh
Posted on Wednesday, March 01, 2000 - 03:29 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Ní mná rialta ach Liam agus a chomhluadar a rinn. Ní thuigim an scéal rómhaith ach oiread, mar lig siad do dhuine 'bastard' a thabhairt ar dhuine eile ar na mallaibh. Fágann sin nach mbíonn siad ródhian orainn i gcónaí (agus bastard a bhí insan an duine, dar liomsa!). Tá na ceithre phonc dearga chomh breá leis an fhocal a bhí ar intinn agat, dar liom féin. Fuair mise na ceithre phonc uair amháin fosta. An f-fhocal a scríobh mé ach bhí sé idir chomhartha athfhriotail. Buíochas nach bhfuil focail dhrochbhéasacha againn i nGaeilge :-)

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Dennis King (donncha.ndip.eskimo.net - 207.54.13.247)
Posted on Wednesday, March 01, 2000 - 09:48 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Bhain mé triail as. Ní féidir linn na focail seo a leanas a rá:

•••• (cac)
•••• (mún)
•••• (pit)
•••• (F-word)

Ach, go bhfóire Dia orainn, tá cead againn an N-word a úsáid - an gcreideann tú é?!?, chomh maith le comhfhocail ar nós pigf****r, cé go bhfuil •••••••••••• (an seancheann a thosaíonn le 'm') crosta orainn. Och och ochón! Má chuirtear córas páistiúil i bhfeidhm, rachaidh na páistí timpeall air. I gcónaí. Agus bainfidh siad sult as an dúshlán.

An Páiste Mór

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williamfuller ( - 199.80.100.23)
Posted on Thursday, March 02, 2000 - 09:47 am:   Edit Post Print Post

a chairde: go raibh maith agaibh. as Bearla, i gcead daoibh- in some conText that isn't clearly remembered, I saw some words that appeared to be Irish at first and after some effort at translating they turned out to be Scot! Anyhow,"Erse" is now checked out & again thanks.

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williamfuller (1cust226.tnt1.ruston.la.da.uu.net - 63.11.21.226)
Posted on Friday, March 03, 2000 - 09:21 am:   Edit Post Print Post

inniu an Aoine: some help, please with some words not in my focloir that appear in Daltai's history archive. Namely, the story about Ruari Mac Easmainn, fifth paragraph, last sentence,- "os na huadarais". Sorry not have quoted the fada for "os". This computer hasn't cooperated with that feature. For whatever help, go raibh maith agat/ agaibh.

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Sáfach
Posted on Sunday, March 05, 2000 - 03:16 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Carrying on with the discussion about what to call the language, Mairéad Ní Mhaonaigh from Altan was interviewed on The Late Session this past Friday. [Fair warning, that link will invoke a download of the current RealAudio file, which is about 5 mb and will only be current until March 10th. If you want the feed instead of the file, click here]

The show host is a speaker, as is Ní Mhaonaigh, and they discussed singing in the language, which they consistently called Gaelic. It was quite interesting to hear that only in some parts of Ireland is singing in Irish controversial, in fact, Ní Mhaonaigh reports that audience members sometimes tell her that they've undertaken the study of the language because they were entranced with the sounds they heard from songs recorded by Altan or Enya.

I never miss this program if I can help it; I have a list of "must buy" CDs as a result!

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williamfuller (1cust65.tnt1.ruston.la.da.uu.net - 63.11.21.65)
Posted on Wednesday, March 08, 2000 - 05:57 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

a friend who helped me further back in my study of Irish was also entranced by Enya & for instance, he was struck by the rapid pace of one of her songs.

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Callie B Newton
Posted on Monday, March 13, 2000 - 11:28 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I have been amazed by the number of people who say "Oh, you mean Gaelic", when I say I am studying Irish.Wouldn't you think that the student of the subject knows the name of the subject ?! I give a succint and polite explanation.

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