Author |
Message |
Sériál
Member Username: Sériál
Post Number: 34 Registered: 06-2011
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 12:19 pm: | |
I've run across a predicament... "Tá lón á ithe ag na fir." vs. "Tá na fir ag ithe lón." (I believe that's what I saw...I'm going from memory so it may be a little incorrect...Gabh mo leisceal...) In articles and other things I have read, I see the "á ithe" construction a lot more possibly because of the third person. I know in first person I see the "ag ithe" construction a lot more. I was just wondering which may acutally be more commonly used in speech and everyday writing, and if there are any subtle differences in conotation or translation between the two sentence constructions? Rosetta stone is more about immersion and association rather than indepth linguistics and grammar, so any info here is greatly appreciated. Go raibh maith agaibh! |
|
Sériál
Member Username: Sériál
Post Number: 35 Registered: 06-2011
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 12:46 pm: | |
And also, just to clarify, are both of these questions correct? "Carb as duit?" and "Cad as duit?" Go raibh maith agaibh! |
|
Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 4021 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 01:24 pm: | |
They are right, but a length accent is missing in the first one : Cárb as duit? The difference between these 2 sentences is just a dialectal difference: cad as duit is Munster Irish. Learn Irish pronunciation here: http://loig.cheveau.ifrance.com/irish/irishsounds/irishsounds.html & http://fsii.gaeilge.org/ |
|
Wee_falorie_man
Member Username: Wee_falorie_man
Post Number: 287 Registered: 04-2006
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 01:32 pm: | |
As far as I know, "Tá an lón á ithe ag na fir" and "Tá na fir ag ithe an lóin" mean exactly the same thing and are equally used. Notice that in the 2nd sentence, the genitive form "lóin" is used. Táim ag léamh an leabhair - the genitive of "leabhar" is used in this sentence. Táim an leabhar á léamh agam - this means the same thing but the genitive is not used in this type of sentence. I think the type of sentence with "á" is often used whenever the genitive form seems a bit awkward or is not known - but I could be wrong on this; I'm only a learner. This is a great question and I look forward to the answers from some of the fluent speakers around here. Cad - southern Ireland |
|
Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 11764 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 01:45 pm: | |
I'd agree with WFM about both being used. And I don't think there is any 1st person 3rd person split. |
|
Wee_falorie_man
Member Username: Wee_falorie_man
Post Number: 288 Registered: 04-2006
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 02:42 pm: | |
Whew, thanks for confirming what I said, Aonghus. A person from Múscraí told me this a few years ago and I never actually double-checked it. |
|
Antaine
Member Username: Antaine
Post Number: 1546 Registered: 10-2004
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 03:52 pm: | |
Rosetta Stone does this a lot. One is a passive construction and one is an active construction. That's not to say that they may not both be used with equal frequency and meaning in practice, but there is a distinction. "Tá na fir ag ithe an lóin" - The men are eating the lunch. "Tá an lón á ithe ag na fir" - The lunch is being eaten by the men. (did RS use "an lón" [the lunch] or "a lón" [their lunch])? Either way, "á ithe" means "at its eating" whereas "ag ithe" is the verbal noun construction "eating." |
|
Sériál
Member Username: Sériál
Post Number: 36 Registered: 06-2011
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2011 - 04:43 pm: | |
Ah, I see. It's more about passive and active voice in the sentences. I know in my writing classes, my professors prefered us to use the active voice. I guess it's just preference on how you want to say it. :) And thanks for the pointers about the genitive case. I still have trouble remembering when to use it. I also have trouble remember which prepositions and constructions cause lention and elipsis too, but I'm working on it slowly. :D Go raibh maith agaibh! |
|