Dia duit:

This is my first posting, so be gentle with me. ;-) I searched the forums for any reference to this topic and couldn't find anything.

I am very interested in the Foclóra Nua Béarla-Gaeilge project under the auspices of Foras na Gaeilge. (See http://www.focloir.ie/.) If this goes as planned there will be a major modern Béarla<-->Gaeilge dictionary available sometime in 2012. I can't tell, though, if the project is still moving or not. The latest news posted on the website is 10 months old.

Does anyone have any inside scoop about this?

Go raibh maith agat,

Seáinín Mac Conraoi

Dia's Muire dhuit, a Sheáinín.

I don't have an inside scoop on the "major modern Béarla<-->Gaeilge dictionary available sometime in 2012" but I am amazed at what is already available through www.focal.ie (new terminology) and Gléacht (a searchable version of Ó'Dónaill). Even Dinneen is available online and can be searched. I am sure its Scottish Gaelic "cousin" the major Scottish Gaelic --> English dictionary, Dwelly, is also available. (I haven't checked.)

Here's hoping for an inside scoop. Since this dictionary project is "all-island" it may have a better chance of surviving the current disastrous financial melt-down.

Dinneen http://glg.csisdmz.ul.ie/index.php?mobile_display=false
Dwelly http://www.dwelly.info/

The corpus on which the new dictionary will be based:
http://corpas.focloir.ie/

I am sceptical about a bureaucracy driven project even without financial constraints. But I don't have the inside scoop either.

I was pleased to get the following message from folks at Foras na Gaeilge concerning this project:

"Thank you for enquiry. The Project is indeed live and well, and we're on target to publish the electronic version of the new dictionary in December 2012 as planned. Unfortunately due to pressure of other work we haven't managed to update our website at all this year - apologies for any inconvenience or for any false impression given - but we aim to remedy this in the near future."

Maith!

Seáinín Mac Conraoi

An-mhaith.

The electronic version more than a year hence... And the real ['hard-copy'] thing ?

Meileann muilte an fhorais go mall ach go garbh!

I have not been able to get much use out of the www.focal.ie, but I use the www.potafocal.com daily. It is probably because I am at such a basic level the focal.ie seldom has any basic thought I'm looking for. I use a mix of dictionaries. My favorite is the old standard "Foclóire Scoile". It is the ONLY Irish dictionary I've found with pronunciation notes which is a must for a beginner. I do not understand this lack of pronunciation guides because pronunciation is such a hurdle for learners of the Irish language. I would like to see pronunciation added to the Potafocal. It would be unmatched if that were added.

Focal.ie is specifically for (technical) terminology rather than ordinary usage, so that is not surprising.

quote:

I would like to see pronunciation added to the Potafocal. It would be unmatched if that were added.

Abair will give you IPA for words

http://www.abair.tcd.ie/?page=lts&lang=gle

Seo leagan deas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKga5UuclNI

Ceann eile (nó an ceann céanna?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qfb5ijeXxo0

(Message edited by Jeaicín on October 04, 2011)

While talking about dictionaries, can any of you VSGs tell me what the following mean in Potafocal when found after word forms?

"gu"
"ai"
"gi"

These are found after forms of the nouns, etc. in potafocal. I can't find where the originator has put a key of any type. I'm just not familiar enough yet with the Irish words to know what case/form he is referring to.

gu ginideach uatha singular genitive
ai ainmneach iolra plural nominative
gi ginideach iolra plural genitive

quote:

My favorite is the old standard "Foclóir Scoile". It is the ONLY Irish dictionary I've found with pronunciation notes which is a must for a beginner.

There's also my dictionary, and unlike Focloir Scoile and Focloir Poca, it gives real and precise pronunciation (and as far as I know, it is the ONLY dictionary that does :-) ). Focloir Scoile and Focloir Poca give a phonological and artificial transcription that's not easy to understand for beginners (and I would even say, for non-linguists)...

http://www.leabharbreac.com/leabhair.html?pID=54

:)

Mais pour ceaux qui ne parlent pas français ....

Beidh orm é a chuir ar mo liosta siopadóireachta!

Lughaidh:

Are you saying you have pronunciation as Gaeilge in all of your 8,000 words? If so, I'd love to buy it to support your work and to get good Ulster pronunciation. Also, is it on-line or do you sell it with a CD?

Ps: I hope with all of your "non-native" bashing it has only native speakers pronouncing. :) )) Níl mé ach ag magadh! Níl fadhb ar bith ma atá tú air.

it gives real and precise pronunciation ...

is it possible to post a few sample entries please?

go raibh maith agat

quote:

Mais pour ceaux qui ne parlent pas français ....

S cuma, thig leat é a úsáid fá choinne an fhuaimnidh amháin.

quote:

Are you saying you have pronunciation as Gaeilge in all of your 8,000 words?

There are about 4000 words in the French-Irish part (with the phonetic for French, for those interested) and about 4000 words in the Irish-French part too.
So you won't find all the words of the Irish language in it, but you'll find the most common ones, I'd say.

quote:

If so, I'd love to buy it to support your work and to get good Ulster pronunciation. Also, is it on-line or do you sell it with a CD?

Well, the pronunciation is written in the IPA. The IPA symbols are explained in the beginning of the dictionary, and there are recordings of the sounds on a website I made specially (which has conjugations etc as well). But the web host (ifrance.com) doesn't work anymore so I have to put all that on another website :-(

A Lughaidh, a chara,

Are the Irish headwords in standard spelling or in dialect?

Would "the same man" appear as "an fear céanna" or would "céanna" be spelled differently? If so do you make it clear to users that it is based on one particular dialect?

In the Irish-French and French-Irish sections do you include Irish words that may be common in other dialects but not generally used in Donegal?

I am looking forward to buying a copy in Dublin sometime soon. I am sure it required huge commitment and dedication to produce and you deserve credit for such an achievement.

Is Irish much studied in France?

When you "pull the website" together with the pronunciation of the Irish words, let me know and I'll order the dictionary. If you pull it together and get the CD to go with the dictionary I'll buy a copy from you today! i might even buy several so other students could get them from me. THERE IS A HUGE NEED FOR THIS!!! That would be a GREAT resource. As a retired lawyer I must point out that you have dodged my question as to who the native speakers are that are pronouncing the words...... :)) sorry... sometimes I can be REAL bad. (Your honor, the witness is unresponsive!...Hee hee)

I would love to have a dictionary that might have the Connemara and the Ulster pronunciation just to hear both.

quote:

Are the Irish headwords in standard spelling or in dialect?

Both. You'll find both "doibh" and "daofa", for example.

quote:

Would "the same man" appear as "an fear céanna" or would "céanna" be spelled differently?

If I remember well you'd find both "céanna" and "céarna" as entries.

quote:

If so do you make it clear to users that it is based on one particular dialect?

What is Ulster has an U, what is Connachta has a C, what is Munster has an M.

quote:

In the Irish-French and French-Irish sections do you include Irish words that may be common in other dialects but not generally used in Donegal?

the vocabulary is mainly Donegal but I have included many words that are more common in Munster or Connachta as well.

quote:

I am looking forward to buying a copy in Dublin sometime soon. I am sure it required huge commitment and dedication to produce and you deserve credit for such an achievement.

Yes it took quite a lot of time but unfortunately it is a pocket dictionary, 4000 words isn't much, and I couldn't put as many examples and idioms as I wanted to.

quote:

Is Irish much studied in France?

No, there are 3 universities where it is taught: Rennes, Brest (I was the teacher there 2 years ago) and Lille. And there, Irish is only an option, you have 3 hours or so, every week, that's all.
There are classes in the Centre Culturel Irlandais in Paris too. Maybe there are other (evening) classes I don't know about. Anyway there aren't many people in France who can teach Irish, except Irish people who are crazy enough to leave Ireland to go and live in France :-)
I only know a handful of French or Breton people who speak Irish fluently.

quote:

When you "pull the website" together with the pronunciation of the Irish words,

my website only has the pronunciation of the sounds (you click on the IPA symbols I've used in the dictionary), so you can hear a slender t, a broad b, etc. It would take much space to record the 4000 words.

quote:

As a retired lawyer I must point out that you have dodged my question as to who the native speakers are that are pronouncing the words...... :))

as I said, the website has only the sounds (in short syllables like ba, aba, ab, ca, aca, ac etc, so that you hear the sounds in all contexts), not words. They have been recorded by me, but for short things like that, I don't think my pronunciation would be much different from that of a native speaker. I've learnt to pronounce Irish by listening to native speakers anyway, and as a linguist I'm able to reproduce what I hear :-) I don't replace every Irish sound by the closest English nor French sound :-)
Anyway it may be hard to make a native speaker pronounce Irish consonants outside any real context, ie. in syllables like aba, aca, aicea, aitea, ie. not in real words. And since I don't live in Donegal it would be hard to ask some native speaker from there to record all that for me :-)

quote:

I would love to have a dictionary that might have the Connemara and the Ulster pronunciation just to hear both.

I'm not good enough in Connemara Irish. You should listen to the vocabulary lists on the CDs of Learning Irish, or listen to Brid Mhor :-)

At the url http://www.gaeilge.org/fsii/ (redirected from http://fsii.gaeilge.org/ ) the mp3 audio files seem to be missing? (404 error not found)
Have they been moved? Please provide the new link if there is one
go raibh maith agaibh
Seosamh

I don't know, I did the recordings but the website isn't mine.
By the way my website http://loig.cheveau.ifrance.com doesn't work either because the host "ifrance", hasn't worked for months. I'm currently making a new version of my site, hosted elsewhere.

Lughaidh: Your site hasn't worked for some time. I've gone to it quite a few times. Post and let us all know when you're back up. I'd love to have a look and a listen.

Féabar