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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 2005- » 2011 (January-February) » Archive through February 04, 2011 » Cómhacht luibhneacha « Previous Next »

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 798
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:09 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

This is a very awkward query - hard to resolve. Chapter 37 of Niamh is entitled "cómhacht luibhneacha".

Luibhneach is either an adjective meaning "digitated, with many fingers" - but it doesn't look like the adjective here.

or Luibhneach is cross-referenced in NÓD1977 to luifearnach "weeds; dross, refuse, rubbish".

Cómhacht luibhneacha - the power of dross?

The context is a specialist in poison arriving at Kincora to enter Gormfhlaith's employ and try to poison Brian Ború, but there is no use in the chapter of the term cómhacht luibhneacha, so it stands alone in the chapter title.

could it mean "the dregs of power", "the last gasp of Gormfhlaith's authority"?

PSD1927 is no help here... it may be just one of those phrases that will be hard to figure out...

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 11285
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:24 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Luibh - an herb

The power of herbs?

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 799
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:27 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

meaning maybe the herbs used to poison someone? But this point is not picked up in the chapter, which doesn't refer to plants or herbs. But it could be the meaning.

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 11287
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:28 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

I would think that any eleventh century poison would involve herbs (or at least plants)!

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Carmanach
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Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1190
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:30 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

quote:

This is a very awkward query - hard to resolve. Chapter 37 of Niamh is entitled "cómhacht luibhneacha".



luibh, pl. luibhneacha - "the power of herbs". Clearly a variant plural of "luibheanna".

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 801
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:32 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Thanks a lot to both of you.

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Carmanach
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Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1192
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:42 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Here's an example from Clear Island:

Luibheanacha [sic] an tailimh (AC:60)

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 803
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 10:47 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

it's great that you are able to find things in your files - it makes it worthwhile keeping electronic files - but a little disappointing that NÓD1977 came up short on the word. (as it did with "guin galáin" - Carmanach did you see the post about dying from running the gauntlet?)

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Carmanach
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Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1194
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 11:06 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

quote:

it's great that you are able to find things in your files - it makes it worthwhile keeping electronic files - but a little disappointing that NÓD1977 came up short on the word.



That's precisely why I started keeping electronic files of everything; it's much easier to find things in a hurry and you get to catalogue all the wonderful Irish which is contained in neither Ó Dónaill nor Dinneen. As I said before, I only include forms from native Gaeltacht speakers, I don't see the point of including non-natives.

As for "guin galúin", I'll go and make a cup of tea and be back in a few minutes :o)

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 11288
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 11:15 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Súil agam nach mbeidh ort guin galúin na n-iriseoirí lasmuigh de Theach Laighean a fhulaingt ar an tslí!

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Carmanach
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Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1196
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 11:57 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Níl siúlta thar thairseach Thigh Laighean agam le dhá bhliain anuas!

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 11292
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 12:03 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Nach méanar dhuit!

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Brídmhór
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Username: Brídmhór

Post Number: 121
Registered: 04-2009


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 12:46 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

"I would think that any eleventh century poison would involve herbs (or at least plants)!"

- some mashed up foxgloves would do nicely, and make it look like a natural death too LOL

But herbs would have been the only healing remedies they would have had too. And they probably knew more about that than we know today.

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 809
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 01:06 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

quote:

Bhí an scéal socair eatarthu ansan. Níorbh fhada go bhfeictí iad coitianta ag imeacht tríd an ínse ar bhruach na glaise bige ag stathadh na luibhneacha agus dhá mbreithniú. Do chítí sa gháirdín iad agus an gnó céanna ar siúl acu. Agus d’admhaíodh Lonnán gurbh fheárr an t-eólas a bhí ag Gormfhlaith ar na luibhneacha agus ar na cómhachtaibh a bhí iontu chun uilc nú chun maitheasa ná mar a bhí aige féin.



Dear all, I overlooked this paragraph in the chapter, which I thought didn't refer to plants, but I see that they are talking about the properties of plants.

I think cómhacht is "property", not "power" here... The good and bad properties of plants.

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 810
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 01:07 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Bríd Mhór, I'm glad I don't know what foxgloves look like!

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Carmanach
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Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1201
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 01:15 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

quote:

Bríd Mhór, I'm glad I don't know what foxgloves look like!



A common flower throughout Ireland. It's quite large with beautiful pink bell-like flowers arranged in whorls around the upper stem. They're called "méireasta na bpúcaí" in Corca Dhuibhne. It's widely known as a poisonous plant but nevertheless the heart drug digitalis is made from the very same poison!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digitalis

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Corkirish
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Username: Corkirish

Post Number: 811
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 01:30 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

That reminds me of the first time I found myself on Ireland's portach! How can ground be spongy? I wondered if I was going to sprain my ankle on the portach!

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Carmanach
Member
Username: Carmanach

Post Number: 1202
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 03:07 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

I remember walking across a peat bog on Achill Island in Mayo. Weird. Like walking across a trampoline.

Of course, turf-cutting has its own myriad of special terms! Ag cnuchairt mhóna, caorán, stualainn, scúnsa portaigh, cos portaigh, athmhóin, barrfhód, scolpán, ceapadóir, fiacail an phortaigh, portaire, etc. Those are a few terms from Cork and Kerry. Other dialects have their own words.

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Brídmhór
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Username: Brídmhór

Post Number: 123
Registered: 04-2009


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 03:16 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

foxglove in Connemara is - méaracán púca (you know the thingy you put on your finger when sewing)which is a good discription.

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 11295
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, January 24, 2011 - 03:26 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit PostPrint Post

Ceist cainníochta seachas cáilíochta is ea nimh.
Digatalin an nimh atá sna méaracáin púca, ach tá leigheas ann má chuirtear an méid ceart ar fáil don othar cheart.



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