Author |
Message |
Sineadw
Member Username: Sineadw
Post Number: 324 Registered: 06-2009
| Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2010 - 10:04 am: |
|
Cé acu ceann a chairde?? Faoin am a chríochnoigh/a gcríochnóidh tú leis |
|
Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 9830 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2010 - 10:19 am: |
|
Tá an chéad ceann litrithe mícheart. Seachas sin, is an chéad ceann litrithe mar "Faoin am a chríochnóidh tú leis" a bheadh agamsa; sílimse nach bhfuil an leagan uruithe mícheart, áfach. Ach is mó seans arís go mbeadh rud éigin mar "Faoin am a bhíonn críochnaithe agat leis" scríofa agam! |
|
Sineadw
Member Username: Sineadw
Post Number: 325 Registered: 06-2009
| Posted on Wednesday, April 28, 2010 - 10:45 am: |
|
Sorry I was in a massive hurry writing that, that first spelling- now where did I get that! Sorry! Thanks a thousand x1000 for clearing that up :) |
|
Mbm
Member Username: Mbm
Post Number: 280 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 06:00 am: |
|
Go caighdeánach, "faoin am a chríochnóidh tú" an leagan ceart. Is é sin, coibhneas díreach a bhíonn tar éis "am". Seans, áfach, gur coibhneas indíreach atá i roinnt de na canúintí. Sa mhéid sin, mar a deir Aonghus, ní gá go mbeadh an leagan eile mícheart ach oiread. Agus aontaímse le hAonghus chomh maith gur seans gur fearr an leagan timchainteach ó thaobh stíle de, ach amháin go gcloífinn leis an aimsir fháistineach san fhochlásal: "faoin am a *bheidh* críochnaithe agat leis". Sa Bhéarla, bheadh an aimsir láithreach i gceist in abairtí den saghas seo: "by the time you *are* finished", ach tá sé sin rud beag míloighciúil, má dhéanann tú do mhachnamh air, mar is don am atá le teacht atá an fochlásal ag tagairt, ní don am i láthair. Bíonn an Ghaeilge (agus neart teangacha Eorpacha eile, go bhfios dom) níos loighciúla i gcásanna mar seo agus cloíonn sí leis an aimsir fháistineach: "faoin am a *bheidh* críochnaithe agat". (Tá eisceacht amháin ann: an aimsir (gnáth)láithreach a úsáidtear tar éis "má" fiú más ag tagairt don am atá le teacht atá tú: "má *bhíonn* tú anseo amárach" seachas "má *bheidh...". Seo an t-aon eisceacht amháin dá bhfuil ann.) Cén aimsir a úsáidfí sa Ghearmáinis, a Aonghus? Mo bhlag sa seanchló Gaelach: www.cainteoir.com
|
|
Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 9838 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 06:09 am: |
|
Aontaíom leat: "Faoin am a bheidh críochnaithe agat leis" níos fearr quote:Cén aimsir a úsáidfí sa Ghearmáinis, a Aonghus? Ceist mhaith. Níl mé cinnte. "Bis du damit fertig bist" a ritheann liom. Is dóigh liom go mba ghá an abairt iomlán a thiontú, le bheith soiléir. |
|
Mbm
Member Username: Mbm
Post Number: 283 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 06:43 am: |
|
Tá suim agam sa cheist seo. In abairt ar nós: "Nuair a thiocfaidh tú abhaile, íosfaidh muid dinnéar" Tá: - fáistineach sa Ghaeilge (nuair a thiocfaidh tú...) - fáistineach sa tSeicis (až přijdeš...) - láithreach sa Bhéarla (when you come...) Céard a bheadh sa Ghearmáinis? Céard a bheadh sa Fhraincis? Céard a bheadh in aon teanga eile dá bhfuil ar eolas ag aon duine eile anseo? Mo bhlag sa seanchló Gaelach: www.cainteoir.com
|
|
David_w
Member Username: David_w
Post Number: 193 Registered: 03-2010
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 07:40 am: |
|
French has the logical future: quand tu arriveras. Finnish has no future tense!! Russian: когда он дойдёт (future - perfective aspect) Spanish: cuando llegará (future) Dála an sgéil, is go minic a deireann na daoine iasachta "when I will arrive", agus mar sin tagann linn é a thuisgint, cé ná fuil sé ceart. Luasgann an tAṫair Peadar mo ṡaoġal!.
|
|
Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 9840 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 07:46 am: |
|
"Nuair a thiocfaidh tú abhaile, íosfaidh muid dinnéar" Tá sé ag dul rite orm Gearmáinis nadúrtha a chuir air seo. Wir essen sobald du nach Hause kommst nó Sobald du nach Hause kommst, essen wir. |
|
Mbm
Member Username: Mbm
Post Number: 286 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 07:55 am: |
|
An láithreach míloighciúil atá sa Ghearmáinis, mar sin. Dála an scéil, bhí mé ag blagáil ar an cheist chéanna le déanaí: http://multikulti.wordpress.com/2009/08/19/call-me-if-you-will-change-your-mind/ Mo bhlag sa seanchló Gaelach: www.cainteoir.com
|
|
David_w
Member Username: David_w
Post Number: 195 Registered: 03-2010
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 08:00 am: |
|
Mbm, that was an interesting blog post. But I think Irish has the illogical present sometimes too. You noticed that after nuair, Irish uses the future. But not after má. The sentence on your blog site was: "If you see the doctor, tell him I was looking for him". PS: I've now read further down in your blog post, and seen that you've covered this point. I had only read a few lines at the top when I posted this. In Irish this is: má chíonn tú an dochtúir, abair leis go rabhas-sa á lorg. (Message edited by david_w on April 29, 2010) Luasgann an tAṫair Peadar mo ṡaoġal!.
|
|
Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 9841 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 08:02 am: |
|
quote:An láithreach míloighciúil atá sa Ghearmáinis, mar sin Ná glac le m'fhocal. Mar a deirim, nílim cinnte. Ní sintéiseoir ró mhaith mé. (Chonac an alt úd nuair a scríobh tú ar dtús é) |
|
Hugo
Member Username: Hugo
Post Number: 51 Registered: 09-2008
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 07:40 pm: |
|
David, in this context - not " cuando llegarás" but "cuando llegues" (subjunctive). |
|
David_w
Member Username: David_w
Post Number: 219 Registered: 03-2010
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 08:02 pm: |
|
Hugo, I should not have ventured into Spanish - it is 23 years since I last studied any Spanish!! Luasgann an tAṫair Peadar mo ṡaoġal!.
|
|
David_w
Member Username: David_w
Post Number: 220 Registered: 03-2010
| Posted on Thursday, April 29, 2010 - 08:04 pm: |
|
I think some explanation of when to use the conditional tense is badly needed in Irish - there are clearly many cases that are non-intuitive to people who aren't Irish. Part of the reason I downloaded Filppula's book on Hiberno-English was to try and figure out how tense usage in Hiberno-English relates to Irish and why Irish people are happier with tense usage in Irish than I am. But I haven't had time to read that book yet. Luasgann an tAṫair Peadar mo ṡaoġal!.
|
|