It always intrigues me as to why people learn new languages especially Irish was it a specific incident, family relations, hearing it in Gaeltacht, reading it on signs etc I'm sure there are interesting stories to tell .With me I went to primary and secondary school same as everyone did Irish was apathetic to it like everyone else went to college and only in my final year did I have a conversion akin to Paul on the way to Damascus- I realised that since Irish people had our own language that we should speak it as our main language so I started attending Conradh na Gaeilge classes and am taking classes for the last 5 years -how about ye??

Hearing a few people speaking Irish in a pub in Hornsey Rd ,London, in the 1990s,I felt a keen sense of loss not being able to understand more than the odd phrase.I've been learning - albeit haphazardly - ever since.I got quite a shock - it had been so long since I'd heard any Gaeilge,and of course the incongruous setting probably helped!

Here in the U.S., we Irish Americans have a strong pride in our Irish heritage. Often, the only outward sign of being Irish happens on St. Patrick's Day. But there are many inward signs of our Irish heritage, especially how we relate to others, whether they are close family members or complete strangers. I've been studying the Irish language for about 10 years to better understand my Irish roots, since I feel that a language is one of the most significant instruments that convey a people's culture and the language is at the root of that culture's conscience and identity.

Why

Got turned on to Irish for the first time by my priest. He recited the Lord's Prayer to me in Irish, and I thought, "Oh, the Irish have their own language?" I was quite ignorant of this at the time. Then I married an Irish woman and my interest went through the roof because our family would be ethnically majority Irish, so I thought it would be good to get to know something about it so I won't be a dumb-dumb when my children come of age. (I have some Irish in me, but mostly English, German, and Italian.) Then we went to Ireland and I was intrigued and challeneged by the language. Since then, I have took it on as my own, though the actual performance hasn't matched the desire, yet.

How

I mainly learn through use, not through doing lessons in a book. With that said, I use dictionaries and grammar books as references. I make quick reference cheat sheets when I am on the go. Then I just have at it -- writing stuff, reading blogs, and listening to speakers. I listen to and enjoy Adhmhaidin and Rónán Beo @ 3 on RnaG. I also am starting to tackle stories and the Bible. I exist in a vacuum where I live, so I don't have anyone to share with, yet; though, I do torture my wife with "Irish Factoid of the Day". She puts up with me a lot. She is very supportive of the language, but can't get into it too much unless we move to Ireland, because she knows she simply won't be able to learn it. (Her learning style is highly dependent on this fact.)

My interest in Ireland in general came quite a few years before my interest in Irish itself. Not only is Irish pleasing to the ear when spoken well, it's unique in many respects. I find the history of the language fascinating. It has had so many ups and downs over the century. Enlightenment, dispossession, language shift, revival etc. Its position in Irish life is at odds with its position in the Constitution. How did this happen? What were the causes? The more I learned the more I had to know.

My primary motivation for learning Irish is to be able to read it. There's so much material out there that is only available in Irish. It's off-limits. Oral communication and pronunciation is a secondary concern for me.

quote:

She is very supportive of the language, but can't get into it too much unless we move to Ireland, because she knows she simply won't be able to learn it. (Her learning style is highly dependent on this fact.)

So maybe you know where *I'm* coming from then? When it comes to Irish, I feel the same way as your wife does a lot of the time. It's hard to 'get into it too much' because sometimes you can't see the light at the end of the tunnel. I see the stick, where's the carrot?

Favourite programme on TG4 is COMHRÁ with Máirtín Tom Sheáinín.

Every once in awhile I'll listen to Nuacht a hAon on RnaG with Gearóid Mac Donncha. Can't understand a lot of it, but the more you listen the more you recognise certain words and phrases that keep popping up.

i wanted to 'conquer' the language, so that the fact that i never mastered the language wouldn't haunt me to my grave - as is the case with other people of the Gaelic Race. Out of my many reasons, this is my one of my strongest.

(Message edited by seamás91 on December 16, 2009)

There are, of course, many reasons and Seamás91 gives an interesting one which upon reflection might be quite an accurate way to decribe the nagging irritation that many, even most, people feel who were brought up in Ireland (of the 26) and put through the education system but for whom Irish remained an untamed native creature.

Most thinking people must find it hard to escape the fact that it is dissatisfying, illogical and even downright embarrassing to have been brought up in a country where the very landscape speaks Irish to its inhabitants through the name of every nook + cranny and every natural feature throughout the country and to have to meekly admit "ní thuigim" when the mountain calls out "Is mise Mullach an Radhairc, an dtuigeann tú?"

I was quite the dab hand at Irish in primary school. I went to the Gaeltacht in Anagaire for a couple of summers (I was only 10 and 11) and I was promoted to the older class there. I enjoyed it but I was a generally interested and curious boy. Then I went to secondary school and I caved in to the general cynicism about Irish. I also felt it was backward looking, dull and it didn't chime with most of my cultural influences which were international and 'cosmopolitan'. All my friends felt the same way I did. The school didn't help either but I am reluctant to blame anyone else.

Eventually I got a job in the Civil Service. The lip service paid to Irish generally confirmed my cynicism but I also made a few firm friends that were fluent and active in Irish language circles. I spent a fair amount of time with a pint in my hand in places where Irish was being spoken and my attitude to the language softened. I became more interested in reading Irish authors (writing in English), strengthened my already strong enough interest in the GAA, did a degree in History and Politics which contained a lot of domestic subject matter and generally became more engaged and open to things Irish. I even married a woman from Kerry!

Our children were born and we enrolled them at birth in the local english medium schools. The lady who minded them at the time had some other children who attended the local Naíonra. Because she was doing collections etc there, we sent our eldest child but had no intention of her going to the adjacent Gaelscoil. The Principal approached me one day and told me that she didn't appear to have an application from us and had she misplaced it. I said that we had little Irish, didn't think she had any chance of getting in and weren't sure if we wanted her to attend in any case. She advised us to keep our options open by applying and we did. By demographic accident (there was never so many non-sibling places available before or since), she was offered a place. By then, she had some good friends in the Naíonra, we realised that the school was excellent and I had begun to nibble at learning. We accepted.

At that stage, it was "in for a penny, in for a pound". There was no way we were going to be left in a position where we couldn't support our daughter as well as if she was attending an English medium school. Classes were attended but I, in particular, had really begun to enjoy it. I stopped attending classes after a couple of years (I don't have the time) but I have loads of outlets to use my Irish. I speak it around the school and all the school-related sporting and social occasions, I have friends that I now exclusively communicate with in Irish and I have four children that I talk with all the time (well - the youngest is only 8 months!). I read lots of books and articles. The only drawback is that I can't bring myself to put in the spadework on my grammar etc. but I'll get there. I have an awful long way to go but I feel part of a community of sorts (in particular my recent trip to Oireachtas na Gaeilge was great). Irish is now an integral and important part of my life and something that I intend to share with anyone who wants to listen!

Well i grew up in Ireland and for one reason or another I was terrible at Irish... I mean really terrible. For some reason (perhaps my parents limited education) and other things I had a terrible fear of Irish and those that taught it. I failed Irish 'twice' on the leaving cert, first time i got an F (think really really really bad here) the second time a marginal improvement with and E (think just realy realy bad here) Believe it or not some of the lads in my class (including myself) couldn't distinguish tá from bhí... that's sad isn't it?

Strange thing is that the second time round on the leaving cert (final exams in high school) I 'wanted' to learn, before that it was something I felt forced to learn. On my own I started to pick up bits and pieces here and there and it made more sense.. I still failed but I made a huge improvment and the best part is that it was now something I was beginning to like and identify with.

since that time it has become a challenge to me and a goal to become fluent at some point. I want to be fluent and be able to say to those that struggle with the language in school or who say its too hard etc etc (pick your excuse) "hey I failed the Irish leaving cert exam but I can speak it now. What's your excuse?" I want that to be an inspiration to others.

Also because the language is so ancient, tied to the land, culture, identity etc. it would seem that by not trying I was giving in to and working with all the forces that have had a hand in its demise (purposely or not) So now I take personal responsibility in what "I" can do about reversing the fortunes of the language.

Now I"ve come to love it and have a strong desire to speak it. I speak about 1000% more Irish than i ever did in school. Love listening to TnG on the laptop if im in Starbucks working on other stuff or watching Tg4 on the computer at home. Learning songs i nGaeilge etc. Is maith é sin. Is mo scéal é sin. GRMA go léir.

As an American I was first introduced to Irish through hearing songs in the language, and promised myself I would learn to sing in Irish. I have been playing Irish Traditional music on the fiddle for years, and have always been a singer.
I began learning from a friend who is fluent, but she moved back to Ireland a few years ago and I have had to learn on my own since then. I have accumulated a small collection of sean nós songs over the years and though I am told that I sing quite well, there are very few places to sing these songs.
I have come to feel that sean nós singing is a rather quixotic pursuit- not much singing is done at music sessions here, and I have often found Irish people to be indifferent or even hostile towards this style of song. I just can't give it up now that I'm hooked, though. there is something very special about this kind of song that I don't hear anywhere else.

Murph - Post recordings on YouTube. You will find an appreciative following.

(Message edited by brídmhór on December 26, 2009)

quote:

there is something very special about this kind of song that I don't hear anywhere else.

If you're ever in NYC area, you might want to check out this link:

http://www.murphguide.com/tradsession.htm

It's gotta be good with a name like Murph!

At these pubs and restaurants listed in Murph's Guide, not only is there great traditional music, you'll often hear someone from the audience joining in with singing in the sean-nos style. Many Irish people in this area love the sean-nos style.

(Message edited by bodhrán on December 26, 2009)

Guevara,

My interest in Irish came about two ways.

Like many people here and across the world, I am an American who has always taken great pride in my Irish ancestry...

But the biggest reason is that I married a woman from Derry who is fluent in Irish. She went to Queen's to learn the language and teach it professionally but we moved back here and she has been teaching here in the States since. She wants me to learn to help her keep up her skills, but her weekly calls to her mother seem to be the best fix.

Oh sure, I've managed to learn the odd phrase here and there, but I like to drag my feet with the language because I am not certain I really want to know what she is saying when she yells at me in the language. While I am certain I should be offended by it all, it is just so damn cute ;-)

I am learning my language largely by myself as in Australia there are few Irish speakers.
I use Buntus Cainte cds/books Teach me Irish dvd and just a heap of stuff sourced from the net and other places.
At the moment i am painting pictures with Irish words in
them... ahaha dathanna and i have written and painted one poem in Irish and a picture illustrating the words.

The why i am reclaiming our language is primarily ANGER i guess and also a truckload of tenacity because i want it... i want it for me first and i want more espicially the young Irish to know it. A kick in the guts for anglocolonization.
NB A tried and true genocidal practice is crushing a cultures language because the outcome is devastating. Loss all round because a cultures language is interwoven into all facets of life.

I must add however i have encountered just a few mind, Irish language nazi types who disgust me with their overt superiority complex that they are more fluent than someone like me. OUR LANGUAGE IS NOT A WEAPON TO CLUB YOUR OWN PEOPLE OVER THE HEAD WITH IN EGOCENTRIC MOMENTS...

I do not subscribe to the theory of 'race' I noticed a few here using it.. There is only one race ='s the human race. The rest is just diverse cultures. Scientific racism is alive and well in the 21st century... the old tried and true divide and conquer number. K thats it.

Guevara:

I grew up in Houston, Texas and went to a small private parochial school that offered only Scottish Highland arts. I learned to do Scottish Highland dancing and I became a fairly accomplished piper. As a small child, I would ask my teachers what the different titles to the songs meant (they were in Scottish Gaelic). I was mystified even as a child by all the effort that went into the art without knowing what anything was called. As an adult, I visited Scotland in search of my "Scottish" roots (as my name is a traditional Scottish surname), and I never felt real satisfied. I ended up visiting the village of Dromore in County Tyrone from which my family emigrated in 1764 to America. I felt very comfortable in Northern Ireland and felt like I belonged there. I was a big fan of Maire Brennan and Enya and Altan (all from Donegal). (Actually saw Mairead Ni Mhonaigh and Franky Kennedy perform years ago in a small bar in Houston. I was fascinated when they sang in "Gaelic" (that's what I called it at the time). I think I fell in love with her as she sang several songs in Gaeilge. Franky died but she's still cranking them out. I'd love to have a few word in Irish with her some day to thank her. I just felt the language was too lost and mysterious for me to attempt at learning it.

About a year ago my wife gave me a subscription to Ancestry.com and I plugged in all of my family info. My dad was real interested in geneology for a long time. We traced our family back to Robert the Bruce, all the kings of Scotland and ultimately to the Irish kings of Ulster and Argyll. Dad was so excited that I suggested that we learn "Irish" together (he already knew about 10 languages). I got on-line and found Oideas Gael and called them to order the Tús Maith course. I then learned that Gaeilge had a dialect called Ulster. We studied intently for about 5 months and were scheduled to leave for Oideas Gael to go to language school last summer, and dad got killed on a tractor 2 days before our departure. Everyone on this forum was so kind to me and sent me condolences. I was so grief-stricken that I couldn't even utter a word of Irish for a while. About two months later, my daughter came up to me and said, "Papi, Tá airgead uiam le do thoil" (she had looked it up in a book). It warmed my heart and about 1 month ago, I picked up my Tus Maith and notes again.

A fellow (Jimmy Brewer) from my old pipe band down in Houston called me last month and said that he had heard that I knew a lot of "Gaelic" and he wanted me to teach him some. I had him order Tús Maith and we've had a couple of lessons. He lives about 40 miles south of me, but he's the only person I know around me who is interested in speaking or learning irish. I love learning a word a day from Michelle Gallen's TalkIrish.com and I study lessons in Tus Maith and sometimes do a lesson from a guy on Youtube who has some great lessons http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7nyXgtuis0. It has given me new incentive to pick it all up and I learn well by teaching the little I know. I would pay to be able to pick up Gaeilge TV here in the states but I haven't figured out how to do it. I usually spend my spare time learning new vocabulary and I hope to become basically proficient in speaking Irish. My student/co-learner and I both speak spanish so we are able to sometimes get to the Gaeilge easier via Spanish.

I know I've rambled but mine is a long, complicated and progressive journey. It is as though something inside of me was searching for something of my past and my identity, and I didn't know what it was. I didn't know what it was called. I did not know how to approach it. When you begin to learn the language that your people have spoken for several thousand years it just gets ahold of you. I hope in time I will be able to find people around me who can have some basic Irish conversations. If not, in time we will develop our own Central Texas Gaeilge and Gaelteacht and it'll be better than sitting by and watching a piece of our collective past go into the dustbin of cultural history. I make huge mistakes writing in Irish, but I've decided to just "DO IT". I have determined that in truth" Is fearr gaeilge briste na bearla cliste."

Thanks for your question. I have enjoyed telling my story, I wish you all a Happy New Year
Faber McMullen

quote:

I would pay to be able to pick up Gaeilge TV here in the states but I haven't figured out how to do it

You can watch TG4 on the web.

http://www.tg4.tv

There is an archive as well, for about six weeks after original broadcast.

I am on satellite internet, so I can't download such files or do live stuff....too much latency and restrictions on downloads. I will however try it at my office and maybe I can download it to a hard drive. Thanks for the suggestion.

That could be tricky. I think it is only streamed due to copyright restrictions (most of the content is produced by independent companies.)

But you will find lots of clips on youtube - mostly songs, but some interviews etc. Those you could download.

Some examples

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=tg4+youtube&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:ga-IE :official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=3Us-S--lNoP00gToqZyTBQ&sa=X&oi=video _result_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CBkQqwQwAA#client=firefox-a&emb=0&q=tg4+you tube+comhr%C3%A1&view=3

These appear to be the whole programmes of the Comhrá series.

Faber, good to hear that you've made a return to your studies. Bullly for you and I'm sure your Dad would be proud.

Nuacht on RTE is a wonderful resource. I'll watch entire newscasts with Siún babbling on beautifully and I'll catch maybe 5% of what she says, but just hearing the cadence, rhythm and flow, in native pronunciation, is an immeasurable help.

http://www.rte.ie/news/nuacht/

Domhnall:

I took Aongus' advice and was finally able to get to TG4 by using a tether on my wife's cell phone. I watched a program called "Jig Gig"....sort of like American Idol.

I was pretty discouraged in that I couldn't understand much of anything. Surely Irish can't be that hard to get a hold of. I will start watching the news or whatever you guys might suggest. It would be good to if they had Sesame street or something.

I met a Mexican waiter one time that spoke perfect English. He said he had learned it all on Sesame Street.

Anyway TG4 will surely take me to the next level and I am glad I figured out a way to get around the "satellite" problem.

It is good to be back,
Faber

When I try to access the RTE.IE news it says it is blocked to people outside of Ireland and Northern Ireland.

Weird huh?
Faber

quote:

It would be good to if they had Sesame street or something.

They have.
But they seem not to have the rights to put it online. If you look at Cartlann - Cúla 4 - you will see some children's programmes. Most of them are dubbed, so soem will be familiar, and some of what they broadcast will be missing.

The problem with RTÉ Player was mentioned before, and seems to be due to them updating their systems. I get the smae the other way round with some US public service and other broadcasters.

I don't see the issue with Nuacht, though. There isn't any copyright/broadcast right conflict with that unlike with programmes where they have bought limited rights. I suggest e-mailing them.

You might want to check out this site which has lessons based around Tg4 news, and includes clips

http://www.nuim.ie/language/vifax/

quote:

About a year ago my wife gave me a subscription to Ancestry.com and I plugged in all of my family info ...

Faberm,
That site can be a real black hole. Many a day I spent delving into my ancestors. I discovered a McConnell from Sherkin Island in the 1800s. Came over to the US from Cobh. Also found a few other Irish ancestors. A revelation for me because none of the Irish names lasted into my family. My wife threatens me at times that we'll change our name to Ó Whittle because she was so upset at giving up Ó Floinn!

Good to hear you're back in the saddle!

quote:

Ó Whittle

Ó Scamhaidh b'fhéidir? :)

quote:

Ó Scamhaidh b'fhéidir? :)

I wish it was that easy! I still don't know what my name means, even though it resembles an English word. Some say white + hall, or white + hill. Others say an Old English word for blanket, sort of equivalent to Blanchett. But I do know where they come from -- Lancashire. We even have a town, Whittle-le-Woods! But I do know it isn't related to the verb whittle. Beyond this, there is mystery ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whittle-le-Woods

Sean:

I already knew my ancestry back to 1764 when the family left Dromore in Tyrone before she gave me the subscription. I had a copy of the deed from when the McMullens left. It was sort of funny when my wife gave me the subscription because she is part English, Native American, etc and was sure I'd find the same about myself. I couldn't find ANYONE in my ancestry for 1000 years that wasn't Irish, Scot or Welsh. My 4 grandparents were: McMullen, Knox, McBride, and Connally (quite the Celtic bunch). We had a bit of a laugh out of it. My dad was most pleased to learn he was a direct descendent of Naill of the Nine Hostages. He thought that was cool enough that we should study Irish together. We had a good time and it is good to be "back in the saddle". The night before he died one of the last things he said to me was, "Wouldn't it be something to speak this to our ancestors". I figure he did pretty soon after that. He didn't really know how to use the internet real well, but he loved me to read all the posts on the Daltai site. He enjoyed the detailed arguments about grammar. He'd laugh out loud when I'd read the stuff all you guys would post. He was very grateful for a couple of recordings that some of the Daltai members posted for us on verbs. He's listen to them over and over.

I think your theory of "Whitehall" makes a lot of sense. I live in a community called "Whitehall" and it seems to be something you see over and over. I look forward to reading your posts. Slán,
Faber

Just to relate a funny story (at least to me). My sister-in-law, wife, and I picked up a cab in Dublin. We were heading down to Dean's Grange from Sandymount, so we had a little time to chat and there had just been a 5.4 earthquake in our area of California, so we were concerned for our family's safety. So we struck up a conversation with the cabbie (who had a very deep Dublin accent!) first about the earthquake, then what brought us to Ireland (because we all sound American). We related that my wife's family is from Ireland, and that her mother's family was also from Ireland, namely the North. We then mention that their name was McGlinchy, and that the whole family through and through we're nationalists. That, apparently, was what this cabbie needed to go off on a 15 or so minute tirade about Mad Dog McGlinchy, and how we were related to great men, and the rest of it. Well, I don't know if this is coming through as funny, but we were like deers in headlights because all we did was mention a last name and we were brought into a whole level of Irish society we didn't bargain for. How about some small talk. I'm glad I didn't mention that I was a Whittle. The moral is, watch out who you discuss genealogy with ... or don't broach topics with your cabbie!

It is worse than that: mention that your name is "Hume" and you will be marked down as "Protestant". Give the name "O'Neill" and you're Catholic, ignoring the fact that the famous John Hume is Catholic and Terence O'Neill, the Northern Prime Minister was Protestant. I'f you have an equatorial tan you will be insulted for coming here at all. Most of the taxis are driven by such new Irish. No wonder we all adhere to the maxim: whatever you say say nothing.

Dia daoibh,

I was born, bred and buttered, as we say, in Yorkshire.
Scottish on my mothers side, Ferguson, and I havn't a clue as to my dads side. There is a rumor that my great grandma came from Liverpool. So if there is any Irish connection there, so be it.

Raised and schooled in the 60s and 70s with the typical English bias towards history.
Left home to travel for a few years in '78 and by '85 was married and living in California.

No real interest in Ireland until 2005 when my son's love of American history had us participating in Civil War reenacting.
We joined a unit that portrayed an Illinois regiment but when they broke up after a year we signed on with a unit who we had seen at quite a few events and who seemed to have a lot of fun on a Saturday night.
We joined the 69th New York State Volunteers,
First Regiment of Thomas Francis Meagher's Irish Brigade.

Now the goal of a reenactor is to be as authentic as possible in all that you do in your portrayal of a civil war soldier. So I took it upon myself to at least learn a few phrases of Irish to speak around camp. I got a few books and a tape set from the library and the rest, as they say, is (Irish) history.

I started with the Pimsleur couse and have gone through most of the tape/ CD offerings out there.
Here in San Diego we are lucky to have the House of Ireland which offers beginning, intermediate and advanced Irish classes, free of charge, that run throughout the year.
I attended a couple of years worth of beginners classes but due to time constraints I have had to let it slide for the moment.
I still play tape and CDs in the car and watch TG4 as much as possible on the computer.

But I find I learn best when speaking with other speakers and there are not too many to speak with on a daily basis. Even my Irish priest and sister at church struggle with even the most basic phrases.

I would love to take a trip to Ireland one day but failing a lottery win I do not see it happening soon.

My son is even more into it than I am, so much so that he has recently joined another living history reenacting group here in Southern California, the West Cork Flying Column, who, I beleive, portray a unit from the Irish Civil War.

Anyway that is Why and How I am learning, or at least trying to learn Irish.

Slán

Garth

quote:

the West Cork Flying Column, who, I beleive, portray a unit from the Irish Civil War.

Indeed yes, a most famous one.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilmichael_Ambush

Aililú! Sin scéal maith. Although McLysaght says Ferguson is a Scottish name "numerous in Ulster" there is Irish in the name.

Just as Aonghus is a distinctively Irish name so also is Fearghus. A phrase of contempt in our house long ago was "Ara. That fella has no gus in him." i.e. he had no falúrum, he'd lost his dingdúrum. etc In my innocence I took "gus" to mean initiative innovation etc.

So both Aonghus and Fearghus mean men of strength and vigour.

The Irish for Ferguson would be Mac Fhearghusa

Tá uncail liom den sloinne úd.

Go raibh maith agaibh Aonghus agus Taidhgín,

It never occured to me that Ferguson could be an Irish name.

Would it have been an "original" Irish name or would it have come over with the plantation Scots, as a seat of the Ferguson clan is in Argyll?

Garth

According to Woulfe (1923) Ferguson/Mac Fearghusa came to Ireland with the Plantation. Ó Fearghusa/Ó Fearghuis, on the other hand, is native to Ireland (specifically West Connacht and Leitrim).

It all depends how one defines "origin".

It's probably the same with "Domhnall". The Scotti from Ireland brought the name to Caledonia and it came back centuries later as "Donaldson". The combination per se is of Scottish origin but core name remains of Irish origin.

If "Ni Dhomhnaill" went to Iceland and came back as "Domhnallsdóttir" two centuries later, how would one define the origin?

Go raibh maith agaibh Aonghus agus Taidhgín,

It never occured to me that Ferguson could be an Irish name.
Would it have been an original "Irish" name or would it have come over with the plantation Scots, as a seat of the Ferguson clan is in Argyll?

Garth