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Alun (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Monday, October 19, 2009 - 08:14 am: |
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In Lesson 14 of PII, the following exanples are given by the author, "Cuir ORT do chóta", "Cuir ORT do chuid éadaigh" and "Chuir sé a chuid éadaigh AIR". The answer key (Conradh na Gaeilge of New England) for questions 16 & 17 shows "Chuir sé AIR a chuid éadaigh agus chuaigh sé amach" as well as "Chuir sí UIRTHI a cóta agus chuaigh sí abhaile". Which is correct? Also is it "Tabhair an bainne dom" or "Tabhair dom an bainne"?. |
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Bodhrán
Member Username: Bodhrán
Post Number: 21 Registered: 09-2009
| Posted on Monday, October 19, 2009 - 10:04 pm: |
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All the sentences (except the last line involving tabhair) are using the different forms of the preposition "ar," which has the meaning, amongst its other meanings, of "on." That is: orm = on me ort = on you air = on him uirthi = on her orainn = on us oraibh = on you (plural) orthu = on them So, I think all the statements that you have above, from the book and from the answer key, are correct. quote:Also is it "Tabhair an bainne dom" or "Tabhair dom an bainne"?. In the back of the book, in the Gaeilge-Béarla section pg 135, you'll find "tabhair dom" (give me), which means "tabhair dom an bainne" is correct. But I don't know if "tabhair an bainne dom" is incorrect. That is, both may be correct. It's like "give me the milk" or "give the milk to me." Both are correct in English. We'll have to wait for someone more advanced than I to answer this question. (Message edited by bodhrán on October 19, 2009) David Gaeilge ar dtús! www.irishbooksandgifts.com
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Seánw
Member Username: Seánw
Post Number: 195 Registered: 07-2009
| Posted on Monday, October 19, 2009 - 10:31 pm: |
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It seems that "Tabhair dom an bainne" would be clearer if what you mean is "hand me the milk". I ndiaidh a chéile a thógtar na caisleáin.
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 8954 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 04:31 am: |
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quote:"Chuir sé AIR a chuid éadaigh agus chuaigh sé amach" as well as "Chuir sí UIRTHI a cóta agus chuaigh sí abhaile". Which is correct? Both. He is masculine, she is feminine. quote:Also is it "Tabhair an bainne dom" or "Tabhair dom an bainne"?. Either. There is a small difference in emphasis, that's all. |
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Alun (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 06:38 am: |
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Some confusion here. My question was concerning word order. Is it "Chuir sé AIR a chuid éadaigh" or "Chuir sé a chuid éadaigh AIR"? |
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 8957 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 08:27 am: |
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Oh. Either works. It's a language, there is more than one correct way to say it! |
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Bodhrán
Member Username: Bodhrán
Post Number: 22 Registered: 09-2009
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 10:22 am: |
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quote:Either works. Can an emphasis be implied, as with the example with tabhair? Ceiltis ar dtús! www.irishbooksandgifts.com
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 8961 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 10:31 am: |
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I'm not sure. I don't see any. |
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Bodhrán
Member Username: Bodhrán
Post Number: 23 Registered: 09-2009
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 10:39 am: |
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I meant to ask in the more general case of using the preposition "ar." and not necessarily with the verb cuir. That is, can there be an implied emphasis when using "ar" depending on where the direct and indirect objects are positioned in the sentence? And a follow up question - are there times when using the preposition "ar" (or other prepositions), where one form (as shown in the example above) cannot be used? I'm asking about simple sentences as shown above. Ceiltis ar dtús! www.irishbooksandgifts.com
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Seánw
Member Username: Seánw
Post Number: 197 Registered: 07-2009
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 12:26 pm: |
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quote:Some confusion here. My question was concerning word order. I have read that often the prepositional pronouns will be bumped up next to the verb, instead of at the end of the phrase, when the phrase is quite long, the relationship between the verb and pronoun is emphasized, or to avoid confusion. With all the examples, though, they make sense either way. They seem to function the same way in English as well. For example, put on your clothes vs. put your clothes on, etc. A language like German regulates these prepositions more rigorously than either Irish or English do. quote:Can an emphasis be implied, as with the example with tabhair? Would emphasis rather be applied by -sa/-se (or changing tone of voice) instead of changing word order? I ndiaidh a chéile a thógtar na caisleáin.
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Sineadw
Member Username: Sineadw
Post Number: 108 Registered: 06-2009
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 12:31 pm: |
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A little bit off topic but may be of interest to OP. I came across 'cuir ort' as a stand alone order, as in 'get dressed'.. so you can shorten it and leave off the clothes altogether :D Goa |
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 8963 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, October 20, 2009 - 02:56 pm: |
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"Bain díot" a bheadh ann dá mba mhaith leat na headaí a bheith as an áireamh |
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