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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 2005- » 2009 (July-August) » Archive through July 29, 2009 » Mearbhall « Previous Next »

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Ardri
Member
Username: Ardri

Post Number: 67
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 11:13 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post


If "d'ullmhaigh mé an lón a d'ith Seán"
means I prepared the dinner that Seán ate, how WOULD you say I prepared the dinner that ate Seán?

(Message edited by ArdRi on July 27, 2009)

Ó go n-ithe an diabhal thú!

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 8549
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 11:35 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Context.

This is one of those conundrums that come up again and again.

I would rephrase it.

D'ith an lón, a d'ullmhaigh mé, Seán.

But it doesn't make a lot of sense. This is why it is usually not really a problem.

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Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg
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Username: Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg

Post Number: 643
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 11:49 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

WHY would you say that?

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Ardri
Member
Username: Ardri

Post Number: 68
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 12:15 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Sonas ort, a Aonghuis.

I know how to change other sentences in these situations but I couldnt for this one! :P

A Domhnaillín,think of all the fantasy,horror and irony in English literature and film!
Dont put a boundary on the Gaelic imagination!


(Message edited by ArdRi on July 27, 2009)

Ó go n-ithe an diabhal thú!

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Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg
Member
Username: Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg

Post Number: 645
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 12:47 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Actually, I would think the ambiguity is something you'd want to retain in a horror context. "We had him for dinner" is so much more chilling than a less ambiguous wording precisely because it takes an everyday construction and invests it with blood-curdling import.

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Ardri
Member
Username: Ardri

Post Number: 69
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 12:52 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

(How dyou use quote blocks?)

I would think "d'ullmhaigh mé an lón a d'ith Seán" has satisfactory ambiguity?

Ó go n-ithe an diabhal thú!

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Taidhgín
Member
Username: Taidhgín

Post Number: 422
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 01:08 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

An lón a d'ullmhaigh mé, d'ith Seán é.
An leon a d'ullmhaigh mé, d'ith sé Seán.

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 8550
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 01:11 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

\ quote { and leave out the spaces }

Lón machnamh, a Thaidhgín!

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James_murphy
Member
Username: James_murphy

Post Number: 308
Registered: 11-2005


Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 02:58 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Munster Irish has developed another solution to avoid ambiguity making use of the indirect relative:

"d'ullmhaigh mé an lón a d'ith Seán" = "I prepared the dinner (or "lunch") that ate Seán" (direct relative).

"d'ullmhaigh mé an lón gur ith Seán é" = "I prepared the dinner that Seán ate" (indirect relative; "gur" is "ar" in Connacht and Ulster).

(Message edited by James_Murphy on July 27, 2009)

Séamus Ó Murċaḋa

Inis fá réim i gcéin san Iarṫar tá
Dá ngoirid luċt léiġinn Tír Éireann fialṁar cáil

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Ardri
Member
Username: Ardri

Post Number: 71
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, July 27, 2009 - 03:11 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Maith thú, a Shéamais!

Ó go n-ithe an diabhal thú!

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 8555
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Tuesday, July 28, 2009 - 10:47 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Bealach eile thart air:

D'ullmhaigh mé lón ite Sheáin



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