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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 2005- » 2008 (September-October) » Archive through September 03, 2008 » Prepositions « Previous Next »

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Riannleighiche
Member
Username: Riannleighiche

Post Number: 8
Registered: 05-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 05:56 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

So, I'm discovering that Irish uses prepositions in all kinds of strange ways.

- Does Irish use verbs like 'to have' and 'to be' to denote having or being? I see examples of things like 'Tá ocras orm' - "Is hunger on-me" - is this a fairly standard grammatical construct? You'd never see, for instance, "Tá me ochrach", would you?

Also..what is the difference between the 'me' and 'mise'?

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Aonghus
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Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 7399
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 06:17 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

quote:

You'd never see, for instance, "Tá me ochrach", would you?



You might, but it would be unusual.

quote:

what is the difference between the 'me' and 'mise'?



adding -se or -sa to a forainm [preposition?] adds emphasis.

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Riannleighiche
Member
Username: Riannleighiche

Post Number: 9
Registered: 05-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 06:39 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

'me' is a pronoun, not a preposition.

So..could someone give an example (and a morpheme-by-morpheme translation, if possible) of where 'me' is appropriate, versus 'mise'?

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 7400
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 08:28 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

I couldn't remember the English word.

Mé and mise, tú and tusa, etc are interchangable.

Lars has a thorough handling of the subject here:

http://www.nualeargais.ie/gnag/gram.htm

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Sieirál
Member
Username: Sieirál

Post Number: 54
Registered: 01-2008


Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 10:20 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Mé is sort of like the regular form. Mise is the emphatic form.

And the "sa" and "se" can aslo attach onto nouns when the meaning is possessive.
EX:
Mo charr = my car
Mo charrsa = MY car (not yours)

do bhord = your table
do bhordsa = YOUR table (not mine)

etc...

It just depends on if you want there to be emphasis or not. If not then just use "mé" if so use "mise".

One good place that "mise" is almost always used is when giving a name using "Is".

Is mise, Sean. = It is ME, Sean.

Other wise it isn't used at all to introduce a name other ways. Such as,

Sean is ainm dom = Sean is a name to me. (lit.)

Idioms are really some of the most difficult things about Irish, but I've found that if you just memorize it and think of it as equal to old English or something where things are always on, or to, or for, or from rather than our more shortened versions of those phrases today.

I hope this helps.
Sláinte,
Sieirál

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Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg
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Username: Domhnaillín_breac_na_dtruslóg

Post Number: 90
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 11:27 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

quote:

It just depends on if you want there to be emphasis or not.


Emphasis, but also contrast. For instance:

A: Bhí tú ann? ("Were you there?")
B: Bhí. Agus tusa? ("I was. And you?")
A: Bhí mise ann, chomh maith. ("I was there as well.")

I wouldn't say the longer forms are particular "emphatic" here-- in the first sentence probably has about the same emphasis as mise in the last. These forms just pop up when there's attention on the individual nature of actions or states.



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