how do you use "some" and "others" as pronouns in their own rights?

"the families of some"
"some had come to speak"
"others had come to speak"
"some were doctors and others were nurses"

etc?

le buíochas

In phrases #2 and #4:
roinnt acu = some (of them)

I'm not sure about the "others" construct

Is féidir "cuid acu" agus "cuid eile" a rá freisin:

Bhí cuid acu ag caint. (some of them)

Bhí cuid eile ag éisteacht. (others)
Bhí an chuid eile ag éisteacht. (the rest)

The solution that Dennis offered sounds better to me for your purposes since you can repeat the construct.

thanks...one more complexity, "we all got something out of it that day"

"Bhain an t-iomlán againn rud éigin asat an lá sin"?

(Message edited by antaine on February 24, 2007)

I believe you're after "as an lá sin" - asat is the 2nd person singular - otherwise it looks go maith to me

"something out of it that day" vs "something out of that day"

even so?

Bhain an t-iomlán againn rud éigin asat as an lá sin.

as = out of him,it

I'm wondering if the preposition as is correct here, or should it be "d?" Níl fhios agam.

Bhain an t-iomlán againn rud éigin asat as an lá sin.

as = out of him,it

I'm wondering if the preposition as is correct here, or should it be "de?" Níl fhios agam.

Mac léinn,
'bain as' is fine

'bain de' - means to take off or remove.
m.sh. - Bain díot do chóta.

Scathach,

From Ó Dónaill's Foclóir Gaeilge-Béarla (FGB) one of the definitions for "bain de," besides the familiar "take off," is (3) "extract," mar shampla Bia a bhaint den talamh, den fharraige, to get food from the land, the sea. In Antaine's sentence "we all got something out of it that day," uses a similar construction as (3) above. That is, "got" has the meaning of extracting, so that's why I think "bain de" may apply.

Also from FGB, under bain as also means (2) get from, make of. There's probably an idiomatic precedence that applies to Antaine's sentence. Then again, maybe there's more than one way of saying it; perhaps dialect comes into play as to whether one uses as or de.

Cloistear rá béil mar

Bain triaill as
Bain úsáid as
Bain ceol as an saol
Bain feidhm as
Bhain tú as mo bhéal é

Dúirt mé cúpla uair le déanaí, i gcomhthéacs an "Group Project":

1) Bhain mé den liosta é. = I deleted / removed it from the list.

Dá ndéarfainn "as" in ionad "de", bheadh ciall eile leis:

2) Bhain mé as an liosta é. = I took it from the list.

For me, the idea of deletion is unambiguous in (1). In sentence (2) I may not have altered the list at all, but rather extracted a word or meaning from it for use elsewhere.

There is some semantic overlap between "as" and "de", so context and convention do come into play.

Scathach, thanks for the list. I can now see where as is a popular and, perhaps for many, the preferred preposition for use with bain to mean get/take.

Scíobh Dennis: Bhain mé den liosta é. = I deleted / removed it from the list.

Dá bhrí sin, Bhain mé den fharraige bia = I deleted/removed food from the sea, nach ea? Yet, following Ó Dónaill's definition (3) for bain de (see above) he would have us think that this statement means I got food from the sea.

Hmmmmm, how do I reconcile the differences? I have an idea..... maybe both are correct! Maybe some of us are familiar with using as for get or take and others, like Mr. Ó Dónaill, have a wider familiarity with either as or de being used with bain to mean get or take.

Otherwise, looks like Ó Dónaill's well revered and oft-cited dictionary needs some correcting.

(Message edited by mac_léinn on February 25, 2007)

"Some" refering to people could also be said "cupla duine".

To try is "triail a bhaint as..." (triail with only one l, don't confuse it with triall = journey)

"Bhain an t-iomlán againn"

maybe that's okay but I would prefer:

"Bhaineamar go léir"

Is "Bhaineamar" Munster Irish by any chance? I have a feeling that might be just the blas yer man is looking for.

Mholfainn: 'Bhaineamar go léir tairbhe as an lá.'

An t-iomlán feels more like 'the total' to me. 'Go léir' is the usual way to say all in this kind of situation.

'rud éigin' is not necessarily a vague 'something'. It can be more definite and mean a CERTAIN (thing). Far better, then, not to try and translate word for word.

What was the 'something' that was gained from the day? a benefit, presumably. Therefore my suggestion of 'tairbhe', which to my ear sounds less 'translated' than 'rud éigin'. That said, there is nothing wrong with 'rud éigin' except that it hints at a lack of a sure touch, perhaps.

"Is "Bhaineamar" Munster Irish by any chance? I have a feeling that might be just the blas yer man is looking for."

It's caighdeán and Munster AFAIK.

I shouldn't have queried "an t-iomlán againn'. I see Google has numerous examples from reliable sources. It was just an unconscious Munster bias, I guess, that made me offer an alternative wording.

Vive le difference!

quote:

Is "Bhaineamar" Munster Irish by any chance?

No, it is Standard.
Munster is: bhaineamair

Lars

Bhaineamair is Munster Irish as well...

quote:

Is feidir go meallaionn tú an uile dhuine roinnt uaireanta, agus cuid acu an uile uair, ach ni féidir go meallaoinn tú an uile dhuine gach uair.

You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.

Abraham Lincoln

An bhfuil aistriúchán seo as Gaeilge ceart, le bhur dtoil?

Tá an sliocht seo le fáil in Lincoln's Yarns and Stories (1904) le A. K. McClure.

Ach cuirtear na focail sin i leith P. T. Barnum freisin!

Fuair mé Lincoln's Yarns and Stories ag http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/2517

The main site is: http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page

What an interesting site! There's over 20,000 free books that can be downloaded. Well, we may never know who actually said the phrase first, Lincoln or Barnum, as I can't find any positive evidence for either as the originator.

Is féidir dallamullóg a chur ar na daoine ar fad cuid den am,
agus is féidir dallamullóg a chur ar chuid de na daoine an t-am ar fad,
ach ní féidir dallamullóg a chur ar na daoine ar fad an t-am ar fad.

Go raibh maith agat a Dennis! Is cuma liom cé duirt an frása ar dtús, ach is breá liomsa é. It's interesting to see the relation of c(h)uid with time and then with {people} in your translation above. I would not have figured that out - and I like the sound of the word "dallamullóg.

I'll have to add this frása to my research list - I never knew who originally said it and I would never had thought it was Lincoln, but I shall positively begin my search for positive evidence.

GRMA arís!