Dia dhaoibh
Cén difríocht idir:

'Sin bord.' agus 'Is bord é sin.'
'Sin é mo bhord.' agus 'Is é sin mo bhord.'
'Is bord é.' agus 'Is é mo bhord é.'

I understand the difference in construction of sentences such as

Is duine cliste é Seán.
agus
Is é Seán mo chara.

The difference depends on whether the complement of 'to be' (is) is definite or not. But what if the SUBJECT of the sentence is indefinite, like:

'Water is a liquid.' or 'Wisdom is a gift from God' etc.

or 'Water is a liquid we drink' or 'Liam is a sort of person that will get angry easily'(when the complement of the copula is quite a long phrase)

GRMA
Daithí

'Sin bord.' agus 'Is bord é sin.'	emphasis
'Sin é mo bhord.' agus 'Is é sin mo bhord.'	None
'Is bord é.' agus 'Is é mo bhord é.'	Mo!
'Is mo bhord é.' agus 'Is é mo bhord é.'	emphasis

In the second cases where emphasis is staetd above, teh statement is emphasised - It's a table, goddammit!

Maybe the first lines of the poem "I gceann mo thrí bliana a bhí mé" (= When I was three years old) by Cathal Ó Searcaigh will help illustrate the use/impact of "sin X" as opposed to "is X é sin".

"Sin clábar! Clábar cáidheach
a chuilcigh," a dúirt m'athair go bagrach
agus mé ag slupairt go súgach
i ndíobhóg os cionn an bhóthair.

This is would be a nice exercise for the translators here!

> I understand the difference in construction of
> sentences such as
>
> Is duine cliste é Seán.
> agus
> Is é Seán mo chara.
>
> The difference depends on whether the complement of 'to
> be' (is) is definite or not. But what if the SUBJECT
> of the sentence is indefinite, like:
>
> 'Water is a liquid.' or 'Wisdom is a gift from
> God' etc.

In Irish, sentences like "water is a liquid" are percieved to be the same type of sentence as "Seán is a clever person". Both are essentially classification sentences. So:

Is duine cliste é Seán.
Is leacht é uisce.
Is bronntanas ó Dhia í saíocht.

> or 'Water is a liquid we drink' or 'Liam is a sort of
> person that will get angry easily'(when the complement
> of the copula is quite a long phrase)

In situations like this, when the complement is very long, the usual strategy is to split it in two. The head stays in its rightful position and the rest is moved off to the end:

Is leacht é uisce a óltar.
Is duine é Liam a éiríonn crosta go héasca.

Thank you all.

Mbm,
What if both the complement and the subject are long i.e.

The place I like most is a house I've built last year.??

Mbm, has anyone every tried to mapp out, or even do a little guide to the, for want of a better way to put it, the 'psycholinguistics' of Irish, i.e. where syntax, semantics, and habitual use by natives comes together? Like in:

"In Irish, sentences like "water is a liquid" are percieved to be the same type of sentence as "Seán is a clever person". Both are essentially classification sentences"

Probably not, but alinged with books like 'Sean Chainnt na nDeise", it would be savage

How would you translate the above sentences with the word 'only' inserted, e.g.

'Seán is only a clever person'
'Water is only a liquid we drink'
etc.

Thanks
Daithí

This is my shot:

níl uisce ach leacht a ólaimíd

Not sure on the níl bit, but anyway, the logic been 'it is not but a liquid that we drink' going on the logic that such statements are definite and a realtive sentance might work

Níl in uisce ach leacht a óltar

And here's my two cent
Níl san uisce ach leachtach a ólann muid.

Níl san uisce ach leachtach a ólaimid. (If you want a more standard version)

I'm a little confused with the Seán one. Do you mean not only that's he's clever but he's something else as well..?

Ní hamháin go bhfuil Seán cliste ach tá sé dathúil chomh maith.
Not only is Seán clever,but he's good looking as well.

quote:

Seán is a clever person

Quite a bad example if you ask me, because I'd probably translate it as:

Is cliste an duine é Seán.

Here's a better one:

Seán is only a human being (i.e. he isn't a deity, or something like that).

And I'm still particularly interested in the one I wrote earlier in this thread:

'The place I like most is a house I've built last year.'

Maidir leis an gceann a luaitear uisce inti: 'Níl in uisce ach...' doesn't the construction 'bí i X' refer only to non-inherent features? You can't say 'Éireannach atá ionam' because if you're Irish that's what you always are and you can't stop being. On the other hand 'Tiománaí atá ionam' is alright. Water is a liquid we drink, and will always be (probably), so...?

Daithí

You can't say 'Éireannach atá ionam'

Is féidir liomsa!

So, sentences like 'Éireannach atá IONATSA', 'Fear atá ionam', 'Bean atá inti',... are correct?

Más Éireannach atá ionat agus Gaeilge ó dhúchas agat, an féidir leatsa na habairtí úd a aistriú? Bheinn an-bhuíoch díot as sin. Níl mórán daoine a bhfuil Gaeile bhreá acu (nó Gaeilge de chineál ar bith go deimhin) ag siúl thart san áit a bhfuil mé i mo chónaí.
Slan
Daithí

Bhuel, an deacracht atá agam ná nach nabróinn na rudaí díreach san slí a ndúirt tusa iad -

Níl san uisce ach leacht a óltar
Níl i Séan ach duine glic (since I assume you meant to disparage Séan)

Bhuel, is rud a bhí mé ag iarradh a fháil amach ná cén chaoi a gcumann tú abairtí a bhfuil an chopail agus 'only' iontu. (Tá súil agam go bhfuil an abairt seo dothuigthe!) - It's only a little dog, This is only a little dog, The beast that bit you is only a little dog etc...


Agus cén chaoi a déarfá:
'The place I like most is a house I built last year.'

Daithí

Tá súil agam go bhfuil an abairt seo dsothuigthe!

Níl ann ach maidrín beag
Níl anseo ach maidrín beag
Ní raibh san ainmhí a d'alp tú ach maidrín beag
An teach a thóg mé anuraidh an áit is ansa liom
nó
an áit is ansa liom ná an teach a thóg mé anuraidh

Mar sin, bhí sé sothuigthe!

An bhfuil difríocht ar bith idir an dá abairt faoin teach a thóg mé?

Tá ceist eile agam. Ó nach féidir úsáid a bhaint as dhá alt sa bhfrása céanna, cén chaoi a déarfá: the first president of Ireland? Céad Úachtarán na hÉireann?!

GRMA

Daithí