http://www.gaelport.com/index.php?page=clippings&id=1622&viewby=date

quote:

Agus sin agat an chuid ba chiallmhaire den chlár. Is cinnte nach bhfuil Gaeilge líofa ag mórán daoine ach tabhair seans dóibh í a chleachtadh agus ní fada go mbeidh sí acu.

Maith an fear a Phóil

Is ríléir domsa go ndeachaigh mo dhuine Manchán Magan amach le meon diúltach seachas ag iarraidh an teanga a spreagadh i measc na ndaoine.

Creidim go ndéanfaidh an clár seo níos mó dochair don teanga ná maith..

I watched the programme with interest. It seemed to me some of those who Manchan encountered could readily understand him, or understand the gist, and replied in English (the piece in the record store springs to mind).

As I was watching it with my family we had a discussion about it. I think it is fair to say that many Irish people who have a fair understanding of Irish, will respond in English because they lack the confidence to respond in Irish to a fluent speaker.

I have a neighbour in Kildare whose father came from Conamara. The father used only Irish at home, but the son always responded in English.

As regards No Bearla the situation as portrayed in the actual programme was not quite as bleak as I had anticipated from the promo

Sounds like your friend is a passive speaker.

One can be fluent in hearing and reading without been able to speak much. Remember, he was trying to be understood so was keeping his Irish simpler that he could have, there was context involved someimtes, and he was from Dublin, so his polite and soft delivery did not frighten them. If he had launched into speed with a Donegal blas I'd say there'd not have been a programme at all as they would have not understood him, nor botherd as he was 'foreign' (as Donegal people are often treated)

now, if only i could see the whole program here in the states...

...sniffle...

Sure and I can comiserate with yourself a Antaine. :( :( :( :( :(

Beir bua agus beannacht.`

You can watch it in the States Antaine, on the web at www.tg4.tv But you'll have to watch it live of course. Though they'll probably stick it in the web archive soon as well.

The reason I can't see it is because I don't have Broadband, I assume that this is the reason Antaine can't see it as well. If only it would come out in a universal format DVD.

Beir bua agus beannacht

quote:

I can't see it is because I don't have Broadband

I have always found it curious why on earth the richest nation of the world keeps using dial-up. Why do you stick to an out-dated technology which is not up to the scratch?

The other point - the cell phones. Especially several years ago all my American peers were in shock and awe that almost all EASTERN Europeans have a mobile phone. Now we have a couple of them per capita, I wonder what they would say now

A Romain a chara,

As I attempted to explain to you recently, which I think made you a bit irritated with me, not all Americans have infinite amounts of money. Now, my household could technically afford to obtain Broadband, but I'm the only person who has asked about such a thing so it has been decided that we shall not be spending the extra money to obtain it. I have DSL at present which takes care of any Internet needs I have except for TG4 :(

Beir bua agus beannacht

It depends on where you live in the United States. The providers of high speed internet do not waste their efforts on rural areas with little populations.

I live about two miles outside of a small town that just got high speed internet. When I called the company to see if I could also get a faster connection they said that they were not planning on expanding in my direction.

And since all high speed connections are controlled and regulated in the United States by contracted companies, I only have one option for a high speed connection...and that is via satellite.

Which is extrememly expensive to install, and costs an outrageous monthly bill!!! It would cost me $125 US (97 Euro) a month for a service that is virtually free just two miles down the road because I live in "rural" America.

It is hard to take part in the modern medias being done in Irish because of this...

quote:

I have DSL at present

Strange - DSL (or at least ADSL as we have it) in my opinion is a broadband connection. What is your connection speed, a Ríona?

quote:

It would cost me $125 US

With all my love to Internet, and being almost always "on" - I agree it is TOO EXPENSIVE. So you are absoluted and redeem in my eyes, a Ghavin! (joke of course - as some people have problems with understanding when humor is involved).

"I have always found it curious why on earth the richest nation of the world keeps using dial-up. Why do you stick to an out-dated technology which is not up to the scratch?"

because the infrastructure is massive. Remember, the Continental US is approximately the size of all of Europe from Portugal to the Aral Sea (or what's left of it) and the latitude of north Scotland to the latitude of Crete.

This stuff is driven by business and $$$. Sometimes companies don't feel its worth their while to go through the expense of updating infrastructure in certain areas if the subscribing population would take 20 years to pay for it. Areas in the mainland west of much smaller Ireland did not get electricity until the 1970s...I'd say that raises more of an eyebrow...

I live in a rural area and just was able to get DSL about 2 years ago. My sister-in-law lives in Washington, DC and makes MUCH more in salary than I do. She elected to remain with dial-up until just last year.

As I understand it, Riona lives with her parents. Therefore, the choice to "have" or "not to have" DSL is not entirely hers....

quote:

Therefore, the choice to "have" or "not to have" DSL is not entirely hers....

But she has it! Therefore, I am puzzled what kind of broadband is she talking about? Fiber?

Scríobh Gavin: I only have one option for a high speed connection...and that is via satellite.....Which is extrememly expensive to install, and costs an outrageous monthly bill!!! It would cost me $125 US (97 Euro) a month for a service that is virtually free just two miles down the road because I live in "rural" America.

Very interesting a Gavin, and sad at the same time. My Dad has a spring-to-fall cabin in Idaho and he plans on replacing his landline phone with statellite to "save money." I've had the suspicion, which you confirm above, that he's going to wind up spending a heck of alot of money doing so. If you would know of a satellite website that I could check it out, I would appreciate it.

Scríobh Ríona: not all Americans have infinite amounts of money

A Ríona a chara, YOU ARE FUNNY!!! (That means humorous, a Róman)).

But Róman makes a good point: If you have DSL, you really have a broadband connection, which should be fast enough for TG4. I work for a telecom company and I'm confused by all the terminology. But I thought I'd mention the DSL factor; Of course I'm not suggesting that you spend more mulla, but maybe it wouldn't hurt for you to contact your DSL provider and see if there's some setting that would improve the DSL performance - just an idea.

A Mhic Leinn an Bhothain

pardon my ignorance but what is a spring-to-fall cabin?

Mac Léinn an Bhothain - tá sé go hiontach agus go raibh maith agat a Shuimhneais as an leasainm! I wonder if that counts towards my tally of pseudonyms - I surely hope so! Bhuel, bhí mé ag smaoinigh ag rá Bothan Samhraidh ach, fanann m'athar ansin ó Earrach go Fómhar, mar sin "spring-to-fall."

An ndeitear fall a chur in ionad \i(fómhar} in Éireann? In case my Irish is incomprehensible,

Does/can one say Fall for Autumn in Ireland? We do here in the States, but I didn't see the word "fall" listed in my Irish-English dictionary as meaning "autumn."

Ní thabharfainn "titim" air, más é sin an cheist atá agat!

Déarfainn "fómhar" mar aistriúchán ar cheachtar acu.

Gabh mo leithscéal, a Mhac Léinn! Cheap mé go raibh tú ag iarraidh an leagan Gaeilge a fhiosrú. Feicim anois go raibh tú ag caint faoi Bhéarla na hÉireann.

The problem with getting high speed connections is that all providers are private business contracted to state regulation. Depending on the contract between your state and the providers the fees vary...while I highly doubt it, the fees in rural Idaho may be cheaper than they are in rural South Dakota.

I hear that right now in the United States...Hughs Net, which uses Direct TV satellite dishes and services, is the most widespread.

A friend of mine down the road has made the switch to satellite and says that he likes it a lot. He is a younger college student who lives on the computer and swears up and down that it is worth the price. However, just like satellite television...one's signal is subject to the weather. If it rains, snows, foggy, or sometimes even the wind itself can effect one's connection.

The only reason I would think about making the switch myself is because I think that the future of the Irish language relies on modern technology and unfortunately...when it comes to the computers...speed is the name of the game. So a dial up connection is not ideal if you want to take part in some of the advances in modern day Irish.

Especially if you want to download shows like No Béarla or the many podcasts I have seen on the net.

quote:

Does/can one say Fall for Autumn in Ireland?

No.

But many old stories divide the year into two halves, at Samhain (November) and Bealtaine(may)

Mo bhothán bealtaine - go - samhain!

Acht ó Bhealtaine go Samhain dob éigean dóibh bheith taobh le n-a seilg agus le n-a bhfiadhach féin mar chothú beatha agus mar thuarastal ó ríoghaibh Éireann:an feólmhach mar biadh aca agus croiceann na mbeithhíoch n-allta mar thuarastal

(An Fhiannuidheacht, Cormac Ó Cadhlaigh, 4ú cló, Áth Cliath 1938)

Tuigim a Abigail, níl fadhb ann. Ach.... b'fhéidir go bhfuil Bearlachas nua de dhith orainn - Titim

Go raibh maith a Gavin as an eolas faoi satailíte. Déarfaidh mé é sin m'athar.

Agus go raibh maith agat a Aonghuis as an eolas faoi ar mBothán Bealtaine-go-Samhain. Tá sé an-suimiúl. I ndiaidh nach raibh fhios againn, is Éireannach é ár mbothán!

FRC-GRMA

You know, I just took my mother's word for it that DSL wasn't Broadband. Maybe it is and I've been missing the chance to watch TG4 all this time. I'll have to figure it out.

Beir bua agus beannacht

so I just watched the one they have up there, and I actually found it heartening. While there were many people, particularly on the street in dublin who claimed no irish, i was surprised he got as many people helping him as he did. The guide at the gaol and the man at the bookstore were very helpful, but even the bus company and post office employees and the waitress were able to understand him enough that while they weren't really able to respond in irish much (with the possible exception of the guy in the post office) he was able to deal with them in irish only and with only a little elbow grease get what he needed.

in short, he was disappointed to find far more irish in dublin than i thought he would.

"the switch to satellite "

Not that fast -no good for on line fragging

And lest I be accused of less than gintiminly behavour:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frag_%28video_gaming%29

Not to be confused with dancing though:

http://www.shagdance.com/

Scríobh BRN:

no good for on line fragging

Since we haven't heard of Ríona doing any video gaming, you're either being naughty or are bad at jokes, a BhRN.

Scríobh Róman:

I have always found it curious why on earth the richest nation of the world keeps using dial-up. Why do you stick to an out-dated technology which is not up to the scratch?

I use dialup because broadband would cost 15x more than I'm currently paying.

While there may be a small subset of wealthy people in the U.S., most are not.

The other point - the cell phones. Especially several years ago all my American peers were in shock and awe that almost all EASTERN Europeans have a mobile phone. Now we have a couple of them per capita, I wonder what they would say now

I'd say you're nuts, but that comes from someone who refuses to be "perpetually available". If you can't reach me at home or work then leave me a message and I'll ring you at my convenience. Sin é. I don't want to chat while walking, while driving, while eating, while visiting the loo, etc. In short, there are only so many times during a day that I reckon a phone call an appropriate use of my time. When I'm "mobile" is when I least want to chat with anyone.

No -I was been serious. The ping time on satelite is inferior to fibre, so the lag on frag games renders it less than optimal.

Believing that some people might not know what fragging was, I cleared it up. Since there is Americans here, I was reminded of an American dance called 'The Shag', a sub-set of swing, I believe. It is amusing over here; but I believe my humour to have more precis than that....

Well I'll have to see if TG4 works then. Can someone give a link to the specific place whare that no Bearla episode is so I can potentially watch it? GRMMA in advance.

Beir bua agus beannacht

the pages don't seem to work that way.

go to www.tg4.tv

click on Siamsaíocht - Cartlann

and right now it's the second one in the list

antaine
tá claonadh agam aontú, post Dé hAoine.
i agree w/ your friday post.

cúpla ceisteanna eile:

what's the point of playing english-language songs throughout the program?

and if he's dedicated to "no béarla" why does he repeatedly use "okay' "right" "you know" and occasionally use words like "language" ????


cac

Go raibh maith agat a Antaine a chara,

That was interesting. I do think that Manchun's perpetual use of "you know" agus "so" is a definite example of how English permiates everything and shows us an example of that problem. His use of OK doesn't worry me so much because lots of languages do that whareas you don't see people speaking other languages dropping in "you know"

Beir bua agus beannacht

A Riona

Why is OK acceptable and "Y'know" not. I might be wrong but my understanding of OK is that is military code used by the American forces during World War II that has found its way into everyday paralnce - (historians: please correct me if I'm wrong). "Y'know" on the other hand is a very common Hiberno-English phrase, and I would hazard a guess that it its usage stems from the use of "an dtuigeann tu?" as a verbal punctuation as Gaeilge.

The daltai here often use the word "bhuel". Is that not the same word (and usage) as "Well" in English, just changed to Irish orthography

On last night's No Bearla I thought the man on the Shankill Road was hilarious when he referred to gaeilge being not too different from English, as we use Telefis instead of the "English" word television.

It was interesting that the Shankill people genuinely did not appear hostile to the language per se, but to its use as an "up yours" device by Republicans (their term - not mine)

he uses them because he can't help it. every culture seems to have an unwritten code...so many inches of personal space, so many seconds of awkwardness in a conversation before one of the two must interject something or resort to a vocalized pause.

Ever have a phone conversation with a pause that both you and your conversation partner attempt to break simultaneously multiple times? It's not coincidence, it's just that since you share a culture you attempt to break the silence at precisely the same second.

Anyway, since he mostly uses english in his life, his vocalized pauses (being somewhat involuntary) are in english.

Someone asked the difference between a fluent student and a native speaker...my litmus test: what language do you swear in when you hit your thumb with a hammer. (somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but you get the idea)...

Tá OK níos sine na sin, a Shuaimhneas

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/okay

quote:

what language do you swear in when you hit your thumb with a hammer

German. Much more satisfying!

Scheisse ;-)

A Rhiona a chara
if you have qwest phone line
they offer 1.5 dsl for less
than the 256 (31$ for the slow and 27$
for the faster) that does not make much sense
but they offered it here to me in seattle
more speed for less money wierd huh?
Roman btw in Eastern Europe(and the rest of the world)the land lines were
so crappy they could not handle the expansion, it was cheaper to build cell networks than fix the old. in the "states" big business is just cheap and will push the cost onto the end user. most utilities here are money making companies not state enterprises ie we have many phone companies those with many custormers get more the rural customers will get less options
and i tend to curse in spannish or yiddish much more expressive.
mmm kaaay?

"Tá OK níos sine na sin, a Shuaimhneas"

Bhuel, a Aonghuis, fiú amhain nach raibh an aois ceart agam, bhí na tír ceart agam

quote:

Tá OK níos sine na sin

Ní raibh a fhios agam é sin! GRMA!

OK - US colloq. - first known use 3/23/1839 by C.G. Greene, editor, in the Boston Morning Post as if abbrev. for "oll korrect" a facetious misspelling of "all correct". Popularized by the use in name of Democratic O.K. Club (1840) in allusion to "Old Kinderhook" nickname for Martin Van Buren after his native town in upstate NY.

Webster's New World Dictionary 2d Edition

So we can't credit the GIs with this one although they did give us "snafu" which is a wonderful word although irrelevant to this thread.

Antaine, you make good points about the involuntary nature of filler words like "you know" I use such expressions constantly and if I were speaking another language than English they just very well might creep in, so maybe I ought not to be so hard on Manchun.

Beir bua agus beannacht

Here's a site that claims the origin of the abbreviation comes from the Choctaw word Okeh, which was used as early as 1824 by then President Andrew Jackson:


http://www.datasync.com/~rsf1/ok.htm

Are there any Choctaw language experts here who could confirm this?

Ní gá broadband a bheith agat le haghaidh you tube, nach fíor?

Deirfinn go mbeadh níos mó Gaeilge faighte aige mas rud é nach raibh sé chomh annoying leo. Ní maith le éinne go mbíonn daoine maslach nó criticiúil faoina gcuid Gaeilge, go mór mór os comhair ceamara.

N'fheadair cén fáth a roghnaigh sé amhrain as Béarla den clár ar fad? I liked his music choices ach caithfidh go raibh sé ag díreadh ar an Béarloir, the casual TG-4 viewer gan Gaeilge that would maybe click through the channels and stop and listen to songs as Béarla and read the subtitles.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Rw87jR7zk4

Níos mó an seo!

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=No+B%C3%A9arla&search=Search

GRMMA a Chailindoll,

Bhi se an greannmhar.

Beir bua agus beannacht

Caithfidh mé a rá nach bhfaca mé féin clár ar chomhchaighdeán le No Béarla le fada an lae.. Thar a bheith spéisiúil, ábhartha agus fíor dom shaol pearsanta.

Ach rud amháin, ceapaim go bhfuil sé saghas galánta nó ardnósach b'fhéidir nuair nach bhfaigheann sé freagra trí ghaeilge.
An chuid is mó acu ní orthu féin atá locht ach an córas oideachais.