First of all, there is no such thing!

The irish speaking population in Dublin is very diverse.

- Neo natives (to use Karhu's definition) who have been brought up, often now in the second or third generation. These people often have a gaeltacht parent/grandparent, but not all do.

- Adult learners who have learned by immersion in the gaeltacht

- Adult learners who are self thought, or learned from courses.

- Gaelscoláirí

- Gaeltacht people who have moved to Dublin for work

The interactions between these groups are complicated - there are overlapping networks rather than communities.

And the standard of Irish varies widely - there are some presenters on Radio na Life, say, who set my teeth on edge!

So it is inaccurate to make any generalisation about Irish spoken in Dublin.

Some people do exhibit the kind of problems Róman talks about - english syntax using Irish words. These are the people who get noticed, because speakers from Dublin who are fluent and well spoken do not get identified as speakers from Dublin.

However; great care is needed. Sometimes, as in the case of "Táim tuirseach", what appears to be Béarlachas is a well established and long standing idiom.

(edit) I agnolige the fact that there is no real dublin irish.(/edit)
I agree in that I think Dublin Irish is not something to be dismissed as it has alot of influences from different sources and dialects, but i do agree with what aonghus said about people using irish with english syntax. I think it is a problem and would need to be addressed.
I think it most affects teenagers as they are not of the complete understanding that other languages contain different syntaxes and therefore require a different approach. I think people who have learned as adults display a greater understanding of syntax in irish, and this also applies to children between 3-10, who do not really comprehend syntax at all at this point in their life.
I also think that dublin english has some characteristics of irish that benefit when learning irish.

You can see in the past few years that learning irish has become a trendy thing to do in Dublin. When I was living in Dublin ( i moved last week), in my estate there are 110 house. I would put a number of about 60-70 people that could speak irish to me ( on different levels vocab abilities) with no real problems. The fact that some people have a lesser vocab does not take away from their ability as they can talk their way around it.
Also, in the colleges there are thriving irish socs. And although Dublin will certainly not become an irish speaking city ( antime soon). It may at some stage be able to set up a Gaeltacht Quarter like belfast. In my opinion this should have already been done in Galway (not sure if it is or not)..

Anyway, anyone have anything to add to my rambling speil about nothing.

(Message edited by niallmac on July 27, 2006)

Fair play dhuit, a Aonghuis (to quote frequent phrase in Ros na Rún) ;-))

Do bhí an-imní orm an abhar so a oscailt. Last time this topic got started by Fear na mBróg (pé scéal é, cá bhfuil sé anois? i laethaenta saoire?) it all ended up in flames and tears. Let's hope this discussion becomes more restrainted than the last topic, which I unfortunately "helped" to turn into turf-war.

So concerning Dublin Irish. If I judge by my country turning Bleá Cliath Irish is possible if political will is present. It might take something close to 50-70 years, i.e. 2-3 generations time. The question remains if there is political will to do so.

Níl fhios agam cá bhfuil FnaB, tagann sé agus imíonn sé. Seans go bhfuil sé ar laethanta saoire.

Maidir le toil chun BhÁC a ghaelú; níl. Ní raibh sna 1920í, agus is cinnte nach bhfuil anois.

Dóchás bréige a bheith ag baint le braith ar pholaitíocht. Aon ní fónta a baineadh amach, is de bharr daoine aonaracha nó pobail bhéaga a baineadh amach é - An tÚdarás, RnaG, TnaG, an tAcht, Gaelscoileanna, ....

In ainneoin fimínteacht mór chuid aos polaitíochta a baineadh na rudaí sin amach.

Agus bhí pobal Ghaeilge BhÁC, agus na Galltachta tré chéile, lárnach sna rudaí sin go léir. Is de bharr sin a thagann olc thar chuimse orm nuair a mhaslaítear an phobail sin der díobh mé.

Táim tuirseach", what appears to be Béarlachas is a well established and long standing idiom

I don't see why it would be a Béarlachas. Many languages use the verb to be + adjective "tired" to say "i'm tired", and they aren’t in contact with English. If we can say "tá tuirse orm" in Irish, it doesn’t mean that "tá mé tuirseach" is a Béarlachas. A Aonghus, nuair a deireas tú "ich bin müde" i nGearmáinis, an síleann tú gur Béarlachas atá ann? Ina dhiaidh sin tá cuma na habairte "i am tired" air! Agus gheobhaidh tú ’n abairt cheannann chéarna i mBriotáinis (me zo skuizh/ skuizh on), i bhFraincis (je suis fatigué), i mBreathnais (rw i wedi blino), srl.

Muna mbíodh Béarla ar bith ariamh in Éirinn, tá mé cinnte go n-abraítí "tá mé tuirseach" ann ar aon nós.

I didn't get this thing about "táim tuirseach". In Learning irish there are frequent examples of similar sentences, including "tá sí cineál tuirseach" on p54.

Tá ceist agam! How about these two:

1) Tá an ceart agat.
2) Tá tú ceart.

Deirim (1) i gcónaí. Ach cloisim (2) go minic.

Dennis, clearly I don't know the answer to your question as to the idiomatic use of ceart. Please overlook my presumptuousness in replying anyway - I couldn't help replying as I couldn't help thinking that a recent post of mine using "tá tú ceart" prompted this message of yours here. I notice in Ó Dónaill's dictionary "tá tú ceart" glossed as "you are right; you are all right". But isn't that confusing? You are right, and you are all right, mean totally, or fairly, different things in English, don't they?

I think if you always say #1, I am going to try to say #1, as it is an idiom further from English. Maybe this is what Róman was getting at with táim tuirseach: books may teach unusual (from the point of view of learners) idioms, and may stress them a bit, and then people get the idea that that is the only way to say things?

Can you think of any more cases where learners overuse a way of saying things closer to the English way? There must be a few more examples of this sort of thing.

Lughaidh, chuir Róman Béarlachas i mo leith de bharr go ndeirim "Táim tuirseach".

Chuige sin a bhí mé.

quote:

However; great care is needed. Sometimes, as in the case of "Táim tuirseach", what appears to be Béarlachas is a well established and long standing idiom.

quote:

in Ó Dónaill's dictionary "tá tú ceart" glossed as "you are right; you are all right". But isn't that confusing? You are right, and you are all right, mean totally, or fairly, different things in English, don't they?

Some speakers make a distinction, roughly as follows:

Tá an ceart aige. = He is right (about something).
Níl an ceart aige. = He is wrong (about something), mistaken.

versus

Tá sé ceart. = He is alright. He's an OK kind of guy.
Níl sé ceart. = He's not alright. There's something (mentally) wrong with him.

But... a lot of other speakers freely say "tá tú ceart" to mean "you have your fact(s) right; I agree with what you've said."

I suspect the latter is an anglicism, but I'm not entirely sure, nor how long it's been in the language. Even if it's an anglicism, there often comes a tipping point in these matters, when a "substandard/suspect/exotic/slangy" usage see-saws into widespread acceptance. So, my question is genuine!

I'd use "Tá tú ceart" in the way Dennis suggests.

But I hear it used where I would use "Tá an ceart agat" on RnaG quite frequently, and often from Gaelatcht people. I have a vague feeling that it is more prominent up North.

Gaeilge Bhlea Cliath cannot be described yet because it is so diverse. As Aonghus has pointed out it is either influenced by one or other dialect or else displays the characteristics of a language learnt in later life. Gaelscoilis now could be something different -- linguists could learn a lot about the learning of Irish from a study of the achievement of children from mainly English-speaking homes in aquiring Irish in the Gaelscoil. If those students emerging from the Gaelscoil feel good about their own Irish then I say good for them. They should be respected for their achievement. Arguing which is the better dialect or who has the "best" Irish is futile and counter productive.

Incidentally Galway is very well situated for an experiment to set up an urban Gaeltacht "Quarter". Areas such as Mionloch are already in the Gaeltacht and only need an influx of Gaeilgeoirí to avail of the benefits of living in an Irish-speaking community. The old native Irish-speakers have all but passed on but new blood could work wonders ...

An attempt was made in Dublin to set up a Gaeltacht in the 1920s. There is a detailed account of it in FEASTA back in the 60s I think. All that remains is the street names "Gaeltacht Park" "Iveragh Avenue" etc It failed because it was thought to be too remote from the city and in any case those promoting it were thought to be on the wrong side in the Civil War. I wonder is it time to try again?

Ní leor grá don teanga chun pobal a bhunú agus a bhuanú.

Is dóigh liom go bhfeadfaí a leithéid a chuir an bun bunaithe ar thionscail - abair dream a bhí ag plé leis na meáin i nGaeilge, agus ansin oifigí dreamanna cosúil le Comhluadar.

Bheidh bunús gnó ansin ag caife, teach tabhairne 7 rl.

Ach ní fiú suainlios do Ghaeilgeoirí a chuir ar bun.

Cad é an difríocht idir 'There's no Dublin Irish' agus 'There's no Irish in Dublin'? -referring to language in both cases.
Má tá daoine ag labhairt Gaeilge i mBaile Átha Cliath le blas Bhaile Átha Cliath, nach Dublin Irish í?
Bím ag caint faoi Gaeilge Chonamara ach nach bhfuil difríochtaí ins na háiteachaí éagsúla i gConamara, idir Ros Muc agus An Cheathrú Rua, mar shampla?
Do go leor daoine taobh amuigh de na háiteachaí sin, ní féidir difríocht a chloisteáil.
Mar an gcéanna le Baile Átha Cliath. Tá daoine a cheapann go bhfuil blas amháin i mBaile Átha Cliath.
Mar sin, má tá grúpa ó Bhaile Átha Cliath ag caint i mBaile Átha Cliath agus blas Bhaile Átha Cliath ar a nGaeilge, nach Dublin Irish í sin?
Chuala mé daoine ag caint i mBaile an tSaoir agus thuig mé go raibh an teanga difriúil i bhfuaim agus rithim agus na nathanna cainte ná Gaeilge a chuala mé sa Ghaeltacht ach chaitheamar an oíche ar fad ag caint i nGaeilge mar sin féin.
Ghlaoigh mé Dublin Irish ar an teanga sin agus bhí áthas orm go raibh Gaeilge i mBaile Átha Cliath.
Céard a cheapann sibh?

quote:

Má tá daoine ag labhairt Gaeilge i mBaile Átha Cliath le blas Bhaile Átha Cliath, nach Dublin Irish í?

Is dócha é. Ach níl ins na daoine sin, a bhfuil blas soaitheanta Bhleá Cliathach ar a gcuid gaeilge, ach cuid sách beag de shaol na Gaeilge i mBaile Atha Cliath.

Níl fiú blas amháin ar Bhéarla Bhleá Cliath - tá ar a laghad dosaen canúint ann.

An rud a bhíos ag iarraidh leiriú ná go bhfuil pobal ilchinéalach Ghaeilge i mBÁC.

For tá tú ceart / Tá an ceart agat, I agree with Dennis. Yes, some speaker do use "tá tú ceart" to mean "what you say is right", even native speakers, but it is under the influence of English, i'm sure. I'm almost sure that "tá tú ceart" wouldn't be used when people only knew Irish.

What's the difference?

Tá ciall eile cloiste agam le "Tá tú ceart" - dá mbeidhfeá ag iarraidh duine a íoc as rud a cheannaigh siad duit, d'fheadfadh siad "Tá tú ceart" a rá in áit "na bac leis" ("You're grand", i mBéarla na hÉireann).

Scríobh O'Dwyer:-

quote:

What's the difference?

No real difference in meaning. What we are trying to tease out is which is the more common among gaeltacht and fluent galltacht speakers of Irish.

My gut feeling, for example, is that "tá tú ceart" is somehow wrong/not authentic for "you are right" - but I can't tell you why. And I'm not about to condemn people who use it. But I rarely do.

Every living language has "registers". I am not sure of the definition but speaking to the parish priest may evoke some restrained formal polite language whereas chatting with "your mates" is likely to demand some colourful slang. I know in the Gaeltacht that speakers may incorporate English words and learners idioms into their Irish for the sheer fun of it. On the other hand the Irish spoken by learners is of necessity more restricted unless they immerse themselves in Raidio na Gaeltachta and Máirtín Tom Sheáinín's programmes. As to whether "Tá tú ceart" or "Tá an ceart agat" is the more correct who knows? Aontaím le hAonghus ach chuala mé "tá tú ceart" ag cainteoirí dúchais. Cloisim "tá tú alraight" acu chomh maith ar ndóigh. Ach oiread le "I done it" agus "I did it" beidh ar na múinteoirí a rá linn cad atá ceart agus cearr ... (I know! I'm messin'. It should be "mícheart").

A Thaidhgín,
This is just a quick note to say I've enjoyed reading your posts and if you're new here,
Fáilte romhat anseo, a chara,

Go raibh maith agat, a Chaitríona. I have been reading the Daltaí forums on and off for some time and I finally decided to take the plunge and try and write in response to some of the topics. It's a great site. As for my standard of Irish I probably have a good knowledge of the language from my home and from my education. It was my best subject. I was reared in Dublin but my parents had a smattering of "traditional" Irish from their rural upbringing and my older siblings, who were in secondary school, were fluent teenagers by the time I came along so the language was always part of our lives. We were Dublin culchies. Unfortunately I don't have a scholarly knowledge of the language so I will not be able to respond to some of the more specialised queries.

Ar aon nós, fágaimis siúd mar atá sé ...

"On the other hand the Irish spoken by learners is of necessity more restricted unless they immerse themselves in Raidio na Gaeltachta and Máirtín Tom Sheáinín's programmes."

I don't really see how listening to a radio program in Iriah will help. If you don't know what they're saying, how can it?

I think the suggestion was targeted to learners who already have basic spoken Irish (say, Leaving Cert level even.) Even though they might not understand every single thing that's being said, it's a good way to pick up idioms and rhythms of native/fluent speech.

I agree that it mightn't be too helpful for absolute beginners with no previous exposure. I've been there, and it felt far more like drowning than immersion! It wasn't till I came back to it a year later that I could understand enough to make it worthwhile. Since then it's been wonderful... I can't listen for 45 minutes without learning something new.

Hi O'Dwyer,

Yes, I agree with Abigail. I have to admit to being a huge fan of Máirtín Tom Sheáinín's programmes. Taidhgín is far from being a beginner and so when he'd hear phrases on the radio, he might have forgotten he'd pick up quickly again on hearing them and acquire or find once again a wonderful blas in the process.

But I see you point. If you haven't learned enough to understand what's happening on the radio, then T.V. and dramas are a better bet because you can see the action and context and pick up phrases and sometimes follow subtitles. In this case a program like Ros na Rún, while challenging, is a good place to pick up phrases. If you're willing just to repeat the sounds back without thinking too much about spelling or grammar or declensions etc. you can have fun parroting words and phrases and do wonders for your speaking ability.
Here’s your T.V. link http://www.tg4.ie/Webt/webt.htm
Enjoy.

Thanks! How much do you think I need to know until radio is helpful?

Hi again,O Dwyer, a chara,
The first thing that popped into my head was the typical thing we used to do at home of answering a question with a question. I wanted to ask 'How much Irish do you have now?'
We'd drive people crazy doing that. Someone would ask for directions saying 'How do you get to...?' and we'd answer, 'Where are you starting from?' We weren't even aware we were doing it. But I digress (as usual!).
It's not an easy question to answer. What you'll discover from a drama like Ros na Rún is that different people have different accents and you'll hear Western Irish and Southern Irish and Northern Irish and Eastern (Dublin) Irish and after a while you'll be able to sort out people who are speaking the same way and you'll probably settle on one way that's your favorite and imitate that. A mixture is fine too.
I'd wait until you feel comfortable understanding a fair amount of the conversation on T.V., even greetings and the main gist of things so you could follow some conversation with your eyes closed before you try the radio to avoid the feeling of 'drowning' rather than being immersed in a comfortable way. Some radio programmes are in one dialect, others in another and when you're comfortable identifying the different accents, you could figure which programme you'd prefer to listen to on the radio.
But none of what I say is scientific and there are many ways to learn a language. Other ways could work better for you. Maybe just keep on the boards here until you feel you've got confidence to write in Irish more but it's a good idea to get the sounds of the language too.
Maybe another learner can help you more on this since I've forgotten when I started listening to the radio and what stage I was at when I did. I'm not sure if this helps or not. I hope it does.

GRMA. I tried posting in Irish, but only the fluent speakers could understand what I was trying to say.

O'Dwyer, you might try watching the children's shows on TG4, like Cruinneas. The vocabulary is more basic and Cruinneas for example always starts off with some basic questions, asking the contestants things like where are you from and what are your hobbies. A few of the speakers' accents are really strong on Ros na Run--which is cool and great practice, but maybe overwhelming if you're not used to hearing the language spoken.

When you feel like you're ready to go without the visual cues, you might try listening to podcasts in Irish. In particular, An tImeall

http://imeall.blogspot.com/

often gives a text summary with the podcast, so you have a better idea of what's going on. I find it easier to listen to podcasts than to the radio, because you can rewind a bit and listen to it over and over until you've got it.

Even if you understand very little, watching tv or listening to the radio in Irish really helps. I've been doing a lot more of both in the past month or two, and it's had a huge effect on my Irish--much more than I expected.

Tá ádh mór leat!

Cruinneas is one of my favourite shows exactly for the reasons you've stated Julie. Actually, I've been meaning to ask you guys which dialect do you think the presenter of Cruinneas has. He sounds like he's from the Munster region originally but says certain words in a non-munster almost standard way, all the kids no matter where they're from seem to understand him.. I love TG4 web TV but wish some of the programs like Cruinneas had Irish language subtitles.

So, If anyone reading this has influence in Gaeilge TV,
subtitles in Irish, le do thoil :)

High,

Táim thar n-ais ó Érinn. Sad to say - but there is no Irish in Dublin. So no point to speak about "Dublin Irish". I heard more Italian, French and all the other languages than I ever heard Irish. Yes, I met couple of people speaking Irish (one in Irish bookshop - the guy way from Gailleamh, second in the office of Foras na Gaeilge and the third one in the shop of Conradh na Gaeilge). Except that - the only Irish I heard was a stilted voice on Luas pronouncing stops. And yes - in George's street I saw one graffitti in Irish, half-extinguished. The remaining fragment read "ag dul i bhfiáin" (going crazy?).

Needless to say - I was extremely disappointed and let down. Not to mention all those strange looks of bemusement and disbelief when I mentioned that I am after studying Irish.

To cut short - this discussion is vain, because it makes more sense to speak about Dublin Polish or Lithuanian - because at least you hear those all the time, than to talk about elusive, almost non-existant Irish in Áth Cliath.

Cheers

Rómán.

Caithfidh tú gaeilge a lorg i mBÁC. Ach tá sí ann.

Tá tú cosúil leis na daoine sin a théann go dtí an nGaeltacht, nach gcloiseann focal gaeilge toisc go bhfuil siad fhéin de shíor ag spalpadh Béarla, agus a mhaíonn nach ann don Ghaeilge nuair a fhilleann siad.

Gheibhim Gaeilge i mBAC, a Rómán, ach tá a fhios agam na háiteanna ina mbíonn í le fáil. Ní bhíonn sí ar fud na háite, ach sna poill 's prochóga i mBAC.

Aonghuis, thanks for your appreciation of my listening skills, still I am not deaf. It might be a surprise for you, but I managed just fine chatting for 15-20 min anywhere where people were willing to speak Irish. So loads of Irish on Inis Mór - I don't understand how Ceolmhar didn't find much - people are really happy to talk to you in Irish, when you approach them with "Dia dhuit", wonderful week in Múscraí trying to talk Irish to anybody, and even in An Daingean my B&B hosts were natives. Anytime I heard somebody speaking Irish I always used the opportunity when appropriate to swap a word. So even non-native lady in the shop in Reidh na nDoirí which I used to frequent used "GRMA" and "Tá fáilte romhat" with me.

I realise that you have to "look hard for" to find any Irish in Dublin, but still, I was expecting to find something more than inscription "Uisce" on rain-drain and 2x smaller Irish names on Luas stops.

Túsphointe do do chuardach an chéad uair eile:

http://www.ionad.org/

http://www.caifeuna.com/

go hairithe:

http://www.ionad.org/fograi/

Tá difear ann idir na himircigh agus Gaeilgeoirí
BhÁC. Tá na Gaeilgeoirí fite fuaite leis an ngnáth pobal Éireannach.

Is beag Éireannach atá a chur faoi i lár na cathrach; mar sin is mó imirceach gona dteanga a chloisfidh tú ann seachas gaeilgeoirí.

Líonraí seachas pobail ghaeilge atá i mBÁC; níos dlúithe thart ar ghaeilscoileanna airithe, nó áiseanna cosúil le hAras Chrónáin (http://www.araschronain.com/).

Aonghuis, a chara,

The very moment I saw a graffitti in Irish in Áth Cliath, I knew there is some underground (almost illicit as it seems) Irish subculture in the capital. But to be frank I was expecting to see more "above"-the-ground Irish manifestations. Not in some out-of-centre place, not in Irish-language section of Sinn Féin propaganda newsletter Dublin News. I am not interested in playing hide-and-seek while deciding if there Irish language in the town or not. You simply stroll the streets and listen carefully. In Gailleamh it took some 10-15 minitutes to hear my first dose of Irish, and this WAS kind of Irish: some woman scolding her hapless child. I had impression she knows the book "500 mallachtaí" (or how it was) by heart. So - no extensive internet research, no underground stuff in the backyard, just a walk around the corner. So I know - there is SOME Irish in Gailleamh - used not for posturing, showing off in intelectual persuits but in everyday situation. I was thrilled and delighted (although I took the pity to the boy) - I saw real not-bookish Irish in action, and this was what I liked.

Chaith mé lá is oíche amháin i mBÁC an samhradh seo. B'in an chéad uair a bhí mé in Éirinn, agus is féidir go bhfuil mé soshásta... ach thaithin fógraí na sráideanna liom -- agus na draenacha áir a thrácht Róman orthu, thug siad gliondar do mo chroí! (Níl ach "Uisce" scríofa orthu... gan aon Bhéarla.)

Chuala mé Gaeilge ó chúpla mo chairde a casadh liom, ó bhean i siopa Chonradh na Gaeilge, agus cuid mhór di i gClub an Ghóilín. (Seisiún amhránaíochta tradisiúnta is é -- ceapaim go bhfuil sé dúnta anois go dtí an fómhar.) Bhí na hamhráin dhá rá i mBéarla den chuid is mó, ach an comhrá sa dá theanga araon. Tráthnóna an-suairc a bhí agam ann.

Ní raibh mé ag súil le Gaeilge a fháil mar teanga na háite... b'fhéidir gur sin an fáth go raibh áthas orm, seachas díoma ar bith, faoin méid a fuair mé.

Abigail

(Tá fáilte mhór roimh cheartúcháin do mo chuid Ghaeilge, mar is gnách.)

Tá gaeltacht ar imeall na Gaillimhe.

quote:

used not for posturing, showing off in intelectual persuits but in everyday situation

.

Sin masla domhsa, agus do na daoine eile atá ar a ndicheall a gclann a thógail le gaeilge i mBÁC. Níor chuala tusa aoinne againn, mar sin, ní ann dúinn? Sin díreach an argóint a bhí ag Hindley in "Death of the Irish Language".

Aonghus,

The lady in Conradh na Gaeilge shop told me she is speaking Irish with the family at home, too. But.. never on the street. And this is exactly a thing I wanted to hear in Dublin - at least one instance of Irish on the street - to no avail.

When language retreat to behind-the-door situations only, then the language is doomed. And it is not Hindley's fault that majority of people just don't care.

Like the other day when I was in the English market the bookseller told me (when asked if she has any Irish books) - (I tried to reproduce conversation as precisely as I can):

- You mean Gaelic, don't you?
- No, I mean Irish, Gaelic is spoken Scotland. But yes, I mean "not English".
- There used to be one book. Let me see... It was there 3 weeks ago...Here it is, but... Can I ask you a question?
- Sure, no problem.
- Can you READ it?
- Yes, why shouldn't I?
- But it is in GAELIC! I don't know a word of it! So can you read it?
- I am studying Irish, I am going to visit gaeltacht soon
- Huh? (blank look) Where do you come from? Are you Russian?
- ?!? No, why?
- There was a show the other night about a Russian who studies Gaelic, I thought it might be you?
<...>

So one can deduce that the lady was pretty sure there is THE foreigner who studies Irish, so I must be him. Really ridiculous assumption unless she is sure that virtually nobody studies the language.

Maybe we were in different parts of Dublin. I got a lot of blank looks; when that happened I'd apologize and switch to English. But people who could speak Irish with me didn't seem much surprised to be addressed in it.

Abigail

Labraimse Gaeilge le mo ghasúr chuile ait!

Bhíodh tráth ann go maslofaí thú as sin a dhéanamh - glacadh leis gur éan corr nó Sealadach a bhí ionat. Tá an ré sin thart, buíochas le Dia. Ach bhí sé olc go leor agus mé ag fás aníos. Tuigim do Mháire. (Bean an tSiopa, más í a bhí ann).

Róman, walking through the centre of dublin is a sure way NOT to find any irish. In fact i dont think you will find too many irish people either. You say you hear more polish than irish. That because the polish live in the general vacinity of inner city dublin (parnell street, waterville row, sheriff street, marlboro st)

Dublin inner city has alot more foreign people in it than irish and the main reason for this is because irish people are trying to get out of this area now that they have money, they have lived there all there life because there houses were worthless and now there worth a fortune cas there in the middle of a busy city.

Short answer! You have to go to the suburbs, the GAA clubs, the pubs, youth houses, to find irish and you will

Aontaím le Niallmac. I agree with Niallmac. There is plenty of Irish in the suburbs as a second-language. The richer the suburb the more education and the more Irish. On reflection that is not entirely true. Irish is found in all suburbs. One of the best Irish-speaking families I know lives in ___________. [Whew! I nearly gave offence there to a family and an area!]

One sure way of finding Irish is to phone the nearest Irish-medium school or Gaelscoil and ask when is their next fund-raising social event. Cuirfidh siad fáilte romhat má tá síntiús agat dóibh. While not all the parents who send their children to such schools speak Irish many do. I am sure if you are not Irish and have learnt the language the Gaelscoil will welcome you with open arms and bring you in to get the children to question you in Irish. If you can speak it well they will all be most impressed.

When you consider that any one Gaelscoil in Dublin has more children on the rolls than any three or four schools combined in the Gaeltacht you will realise that there is a large network of people in the locality supporting that school. They are not a visible / audible community but they are there. Agus bíonn cuid mhaith acu ag caint Gaeilge eatarthu féin agus lena chéile. Caithfidh tú aithne a chur orthu. You must get to know them.

quote:

One of the best Irish-speaking families I know lives in ___________. [Whew! I nearly gave offence there to a family and an area!]

Offence? Ach á moladh a bhí tú! :-) Is suimiúil an scéal é seo. GRMA!