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Maidhc_Ó_g
Member Username: Maidhc_Ó_g
Post Number: 147 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 02:34 am: |
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Well, there you have it. It says in ÓSiadhail that it's "mara + copula", but gives no real good examples. So could someone show me any examples of "if/if not + copula" - 'má/mara + is' ? Something's telling me that I'm looking right through it. Like 'mara' = "if not" and 'marab' = past neg. (cop.) / conditional neg. (cop.) - " if wasn't/weren't." |
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Maidhc_Ó_g
Member Username: Maidhc_Ó_g
Post Number: 148 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 02:56 am: |
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Ok, after a little reading. Would it be "Mara mé, thú, é, í, muid, síbh, iad" - 'If I'm not (cop.).....?' "Marab mé, thú, ...... - 'If I wasn't/weren't ?' |
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Fear_na_mbróg
Member Username: Fear_na_mbróg
Post Number: 1034 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 07:59 am: |
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I think "mura" is more standard: If it's not a pen, it won't write! Mura peann é, ní scríobhfaidh sé! If it isn't a bird, it won't fly! Murab éin é, ní eitleoidh sé! If it wasn't a pen, he wouldn't have written with it. Murar pheann é, níor scríobh sé leis (not sure which tense to use). If it wasn't a bird, it wouldn't have flown. Murarbh pheann é, níor éitil se. (not sure which tense to use). Fáilte Roimh Cheartúcháin Correct me for the love of God... I'm a perfectionist! : )
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Peter
Member Username: Peter
Post Number: 11 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 08:18 am: |
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These are all present forms: Mara mise an dochtúr (if I'm not a doctor) Mara thusa an dochtúr (if you are not a doctor) Mara muide na dochtúirí (if we are not doctors) Mara sibhse na dochtúirí (if you are not doctors) But: Marab é an dochtúr é (if he is not a doctor) Marab í an dochtúr í (if she is not a doctor) Marab iad na dochtúirí iad (if they are not doctors) Or: marab eisean an dochtúr marab ise an dochtúr marab iadsan an dochtúr Or (with a name): marab é Peadar an dochtúr marab í Máire an dochtúr marab iad Peadar is Máire na dochtúirí mara mba is 'if not'+ copula in the past/conditional for all the persons: mara mba mise an dochtúr (if I was/were not a doctor) mara mba thusa an dochtúr (if you were not a doctor) mara mba é an dochtúr é etc. (if he was/were not a doctor) It's dialectal. In Standard Irish you got 'mura' (containing the copula already) in the present before consonants (mura mise an dochtúir etc.), and 'murab' before vowels (murab eisean an dochtúir, murab as Gaillimh é 'if he's not from Galway', etc.) and 'murar' in the past/conditional before consonants and 'murarbh' before vowels (murar mise an dochtúir, murarbh as Gaillinh é 'if he was not from Galway). Uf. Le meas, Peter |
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Maidhc_Ó_g
Member Username: Maidhc_Ó_g
Post Number: 149 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 08:45 am: |
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Ok, so it appears that the verb is understood with the copula forms, though I'm still confused to which forms to use where. It looks like Mura (I think you're right that this is the standard.) ummm. Mura mé or nouns beginning with a consonant, muran thú, murab é/í and nouns beginning with a vowel (iad??) And Murar and Murarbh completely lose me. |
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Maidhc_Ó_g
Member Username: Maidhc_Ó_g
Post Number: 150 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 05:42 pm: |
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Grmma Peter! Somehow ,I missed your post ahead of mine earlier. I was doing a lot of surfing and 'back and forth'. I must've skipped right passed somehow. In ÓSiadhail, he gives a 'maran thúsa...' in Ch11 exercise C-#4. Would that be the past/conditional w/ thú(sa) then ? Did I actually get one right? |
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Peter
Member Username: Peter
Post Number: 12 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Friday, February 24, 2006 - 08:40 am: |
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Bhoil, I don't have the LI at hand now, but I have consulted de Bhaldraithe's Morphology of Cois Fhairrge Irish. I gather you can say "maran tusa..." with the present meaning. His examples: maran sibse ata/ thart maran bo/thar eici/nt eile thug se/ air fe/in maran iarraidh ar bith a fuair se/ maran eadh Past time/conditional contexts: maran duine eile acab a bheadh ann dubhairt se/ leis maran e/ sin a bhi/ uaim go gcuirfeadh se/ an rud ceart agam He suggests that 'maran' can also be used along with "mara (before consonants); marab (before vowels)" as a present copula form. Feel free to use it, though, so to say, it seems to be even more dialectal than the two above for O/ Siadhail gives them (mara and marab) as most frequent forms of the dialect. Hope you'll find it useful. Up Connemara Irish!!! |
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