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Croga75
Member Username: Croga75
Post Number: 23 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2006 - 02:58 pm: |
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in my book "teach yourself irish" it teaches conas tá tú..but i have read in other sites that conas atá tú is the correct way. also....when i had the first edition it taught cad as tú for where are you from.but in the newer version its cad as duit......are they both correct.? |
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Fear_na_mbróg
Member Username: Fear_na_mbróg
Post Number: 972 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2006 - 03:06 pm: |
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You stick "a" before a verb when it's not a normal straightforward sentence: Cathain a d'fhág tú? Conas a dhún tú an doras? Thus, you would have: Conas atá tú? ("atá" is slightly special in that the "a" becomes part of the word). As for: Conas tá tú? It's confined (I think?) mostly to Munster, but nonetheless it's correct. Both forms are correct. -- When you're saying where you're from, you can choose to "do" or not to use it: Is as Meiriceá mé. Is as Meiriceá dom. Both are correct. Fáilte Roimh Cheartúcháin
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 914 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2006 - 03:12 pm: |
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All the question words are followed by relative forms of the verb, either direct relative of indirect: Cé atá ag an doras? Conas atá tú? Cathain a bhí tú ann? Cé mhéad atá air? Cén fáth a bhfuil tú ag fanacht? Cén uair a cheannaigh tú é? Cá a bhfuil sé? Cén áit a bhfuil sé? But... the relative particle gets swallowed in pronunciation in many of those cases and is consequently not written. It's quite rare, for example, to ever see anything other than "cá bhfuil?" But since "a" is not readily swallowed in "cén áit a bhfuil..." it is practically always written, too. The deal with "conas atá" is that the final 's' of "conas" and the 't' of "atá" are homorganic (pronounced with the tongue in same place), so it's easy to slide between them and drop the intervening "a". |
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Croga75
Member Username: Croga75
Post Number: 24 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2006 - 03:33 pm: |
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go raibh maith agaibh |
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Domhnall
Member Username: Domhnall
Post Number: 474 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2006 - 03:53 pm: |
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In Munster they say "Conas tánn tú" "Conas atá tú" is what's told to most school children But, in Ulster they'd say Goidé/Cad é/Caidé mar atá tú? In the Connaught they'd say "Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?" And of course there's Halló. Haigh. And Bhuel (Well!?) A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river
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Ceolmhar
Member Username: Ceolmhar
Post Number: 19 Registered: 11-2005
| Posted on Sunday, January 29, 2006 - 02:59 am: |
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"Conas atá tú" is what's taugh in Dublin schools. I prefer "Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?". Sounds nicer. Currently learning Irish and English. Please bear with me.
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 1225 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Sunday, January 29, 2006 - 08:32 am: |
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"Conas atá tú" is what's taugh in Dublin schools. Yeah, and it's really stupid because nobody says it (except learners, like). They 'd better teach things that exist in the Gaeltacht... Tír Chonaill abú!
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Croga75
Member Username: Croga75
Post Number: 27 Registered: 01-2006
| Posted on Sunday, January 29, 2006 - 11:14 am: |
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which is actualy heard more.cad é mar atá tú? nó cén chaoi a bhfuil tú? |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 1226 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Sunday, January 29, 2006 - 06:27 pm: |
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I don't know which dialect is the most spoken one. If we don't count all people who have learnt a bit of Irish at school, for real speakers the most spoken dialect must be the Donegal or the Connemara one, so the most used sentence must be cén chaoi a bhfuil tú? or Cad é mar atá tú? Tír Chonaill abú!
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 2890 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Monday, January 30, 2006 - 06:31 am: |
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Cionaodh
Member Username: Cionaodh
Post Number: 135 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Monday, January 30, 2006 - 07:37 am: |
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Scríobh Domhnall: In Munster they say "Conas tánn tú" or "Conas taoi?" http://www.gaeilge.org FRC - Fáilte Roimh Cheartúcháin
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 2893 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Monday, January 30, 2006 - 07:46 am: |
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and! You'll here both, and several informal types of greeting too. |
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Antaine
Member Username: Antaine
Post Number: 637 Registered: 10-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, January 31, 2006 - 12:13 am: |
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I lean towards conas atá tú for two reasons 1) it most closely corresponds to the english 'how are you' and so I think is easier for most of my student friends to remember 2) it reinforces a link to other european languages - I asked 'conas atá tú' of a colombian friend of mine at work, and he answered me in spanish and then followed with ¿Cómo está tu? which surprised me because I didn't think that was supposed to be followed by a 'tu' but when I asked him to repeat himself he said exactly the same thing again, so I'm thinking it might be a dialect thing for his part of Colombia (I don't speak Spanish). Anyway, he thought I asked him in Spanish, and it took me a good fifteen minutes to explain about the Irish. Wow, did I ramble there or what? Okay, time for bed. |
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Domhnall
Member Username: Domhnall
Post Number: 476 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, January 31, 2006 - 04:55 pm: |
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They may only be used in their respective parts of the country but a Gaeilgeoir will know what you're saying.. A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river
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Dennis
Member Username: Dennis
Post Number: 926 Registered: 02-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, January 31, 2006 - 08:27 pm: |
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Anois, cuir Gaeilge ar: Wazzup? Howzit? How y'all doin? Howdy! Creid nó ná creid, Howdy a deirimse go nádúrtha. Agus ní buachaill bó de chuid Hollywood mé. |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 1228 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 05:45 am: |
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it most closely corresponds to the english 'how are you' and so I think is easier for most of my student friends to remember Conas atánn tú, Cad é mar atá tú and Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú all literally mean "how are you"... The way you say "how" is just different according to the part of Ireland you come from. 2) it reinforces a link to other european languages - I asked 'conas atá tú' of a colombian friend of mine at work, and he answered me in spanish and then followed with ¿Cómo está tu? Isn't it "Cómo estás" ? I thought "cómo está?" = how is he? but I may be mistaken because I don't speak Spanish too well. Anyway, the similarity in sound between the Spanish and the Irish sentence is just a chance, for "cómo" and "conas". tá and estás are etymologically similar, I think: Sp estar < Latin stare, Old Irish ad-tá < at-stá- ? (Dennis will correct me if I am wrong). Tír Chonaill abú!
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Antaine
Member Username: Antaine
Post Number: 639 Registered: 10-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 09:33 am: |
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"Conas atánn tú, Cad é mar atá tú and Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú all literally mean "how are you"... The way you say "how" is just different according to the part of Ireland you come from." yes, but what I meant was conas=how atá=are tú=you = how are you for someone who only speaks english I've found that they remember that far easier, it's short, and the words and word order correspond exactly to that they're used to saying with a one-to-one ratio of Irish words to english words. As for the Spanish, I don't know. As I said, I don't speak it. Unlike most of my friends I took French all through school (and have recently begun trying to reclaim what I lost after so many years...sigh). The guy also doesn't speak the Spanish any of us here would learn in school, so what his dialect has to say about it I have no idea...all I know is what he said when he thought I was speaking Spanish. |
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Max
Member Username: Max
Post Number: 302 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 10:15 am: |
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"Cad é mar atá tú?"* and "Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?"** do not "literally" mean "How are you?". * "What is it like you are?" ** "What way is it that you are?" |
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 2900 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 11:02 am: |
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Max
Member Username: Max
Post Number: 303 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 01:00 pm: |
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The same shift in meaning happens in French with "littéralement". My position is the same as in English. |
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Domhnall
Member Username: Domhnall
Post Number: 481 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 01:18 pm: |
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"Anois, cuir Gaeilge ar: Wazzup? Howzit? How y'all doin? Howdy! " Whazzup Hows sí cuttin How are ye dúin Hhowdí ! A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 1229 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Wednesday, February 01, 2006 - 07:00 pm: |
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"Cad é mar atá tú?"* and "Cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?"** do not "literally" mean "How are you?". * "What is it like you are?" ** "What way is it that you are?" Then "conas" doesn't literally mean "how" but "what manner". And if you go till the very meaning of "bhfuil", it doesn't mean "to be" but "to see" in archaic Irish (Welsh cognate: gwel-) ; "cén chaoi" is "what (is) the way", "cad é mar atá tú" is what is he like that thou art", etc ;-) Tír Chonaill abú!
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Max
Member Username: Max
Post Number: 306 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Thursday, February 02, 2006 - 05:43 am: |
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>>Then "conas" doesn't literally mean "how" but "what manner". >>And if you go till the very meaning of "bhfuil", it doesn't mean "to be" but "to see" in archaic Irish. The expression "very meaning" doesn't mean much, especially if you are in fact refering to the etymilogy. The meaning of "connas" and "bhfuil" are what they are synchronically... |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 1231 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Thursday, February 02, 2006 - 09:49 am: |
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Synchronically, "cad é mar" isn't perceived as "like what" by speakers either, just like "conas". "What manner" would be "cad é 'n dóigh" in Donegal, not "cad é mar". Tír Chonaill abú!
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Max
Member Username: Max
Post Number: 310 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Thursday, February 02, 2006 - 07:25 pm: |
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>> isn't perceived It is tricky to rely on people's perception, because it varies a lot. (For instance, illiterate people cut sentences into groups of words (syntagmes) and seem to be unable to go beyond, whereas literate people sometimes see more than there actually is because of the influence of spelling. But the language itself works the same way for everybody.) |
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Seán Ó Luasa (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 12:31 am: |
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Me and all my pals use "Conas taoi?". I think it, of all of them is the most pleasant sounding. I especially like how it's no small feat to pronouce it properly; somewhere in between "tea " and "thea". P.S. An Canúint Cúige Mumhan abú! |
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Domhnall
Member Username: Domhnall
Post Number: 493 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 06:47 am: |
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Cén áit ina bhfuil tú? Port Láirge? Corcaigh? Ciarraí? Níor chuala mé duine ar bith ag rá Conas Taoi taobh amuigh des na ceantair sin. A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river
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Cionaodh
Member Username: Cionaodh
Post Number: 144 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 07:40 am: |
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A Dhomhnall, It seems to be a generational thing. I've heard "Conas tánn tú?" more often from younger people and "Conas taoi?" more often from the over-40 set. Anyone else notice this? http://www.gaeilge.org FRC - Fáilte Roimh Cheartúcháin
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Domhnall
Member Username: Domhnall
Post Number: 495 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 10:33 am: |
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Since you have FRC Cionaodh, It's A Dhomhnaill. A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river
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Róman (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 11:18 am: |
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Tá an ceart agat, a Dhónaill. |
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Cionaodh
Member Username: Cionaodh
Post Number: 145 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 11:58 am: |
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GRMA, a Dhomhnaill; I plead lack of caffeine when I failed to attenuate your name's ending. It was early morning here when I wrote. ;-) http://www.gaeilge.org FRC - Fáilte Roimh Cheartúcháin
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Seán O Luasa (Unregistered Guest) Unregistered guest Posted From:
| Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 12:01 pm: |
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A Dhomhnaill, Nod a bhí "Canúint Cúige Mumhan Abú" ; sea, is as Corcaigh mé. Go n-éirí leat. |
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