Can someone tell me how the word 'Friendship' would be translated?

Cairdeas

I make greeting cards & have been asked to make one for a gentleman & the sender wants
"Happy Birthday on this your Special Day" in Irish on the front of the card
Can anyone translate for me?

Happy Birthday - Lá Breithe Shona
On your special day - ar do lá speisialta
That's a literal translation so maybe change the second part around to :
Bíodh áthas ort an lá seo - Be happy this day.
Bain taitneamh as an lá - Enjoy the day.
Bíodh lá lán le searc is sult agat - Have a day full of love and fun...

Other people might have better ideas......

Happy Birthday - Lá Breithe Shona
On your special day - ar do lá speisialta
That's a literal translation so maybe change the second part around to :
Bíodh áthas ort an lá seo - Be happy this day.
Bain taitneamh as an lá - Enjoy the day.
Bíodh lá lán le searc is sult agat - Have a day full of love and fun...

Other people might have better ideas......

Lá Breithe Sona, gan séimhiú, go bhfios domh, mar nach bhfuil "lá" baininscneach agus nach í a’ bhreith atá sona ach an lá.

Agus dá mba é an cás gurbh í an bhreith a bhí sona, go fóill ní bheadh séimhiú ar "sona"... mar ní shéimhítear túschonsan na haidiachta sa tuiseal ginideach ; )

Séimhíthear nuair is ainmfhocal firinscneach sa tuiseal ghinideach atá roimhe’n aidiacht. Ach ansin tá "breith" baininscneach, mar sin ní féidir séimhiú a bheith ar aidiacht ar bith ina dhiaidh ’s "breith" féin sa tuiseal ghinideach.

Sin a bhí de rún agam a rá -- ach d'fhágas ar lár gur faoi ainmfhocal baininscneach a bhí mé ag caint.

I prefer to use "Bain sult as..." to express "enjoy" - Bain sult as an lá - and I would use Lá breithe shona duit"

"Lá breithe shona" is often said/written, but the strict standard is without the "h".

It's like "Dia d(h)uit".

Maybe one of the langauge lawyers knows the deeper reason for this usage versus standrad dichotomy.

(Message edited by aonghus on December 08, 2005)

Putting an h there is a mistake, there is absolutely no reason for putting a lenition there. And it isn't like "Dia d(h)uit".

I think the reason a lot of people get confused about that is because it's an adjective following the feminine breith, although breithlá is masculine.

We see such things as "breith Chríost" so I'm suggesting that there is a reason for the lenition. I'm not saying that it's correct, merely offering it as an explanation why we see both versions.

Gotta love the Lughaidh attitude! ; )

While there are strong rules in place for lentition (ie. you're either right or you're wrong for sticking a "h" somewhere), they're pretty much down to personal taste when you've working with prepositions (I think!).

an madra (right)
an mhadra (wrong!)
ainm an madra (wrong!)
ainm an mhadra (right!)
áit beag (wrong!)
capall mhór (wrong!)
ainm na háite bhige (wrong!)

I tend to stick a "h" on a preposition from time to time, depending on the sound that comes before it... my subconscious does it so I'd find it hard to rhyme off a list of what makes me say "dhom" instead of "dom".

As for "Lá Breithe Shona" -- if indeed people stick a séimhiú on "Sona" then I'd say it's because "X Shona" has become somewhat of an idiom.

For instance, when something has become "idiomised" in English, grammatical rules no longer apply, eg.:

He left school.

Look at that sentence -- "school" is in the singular. When something is in the singular, if it's the definite article, it's preceeded by "the"; if it's the indefinite article, it's preceeded by "a"... but this has neither! It's grammatically wrong! But still no-one complains... not even a grammarian!

I went to college after I left school.

So maybe people are just used to "X Shona"... ?

Breith is feminine, but in "lá breithe" it is in the genitive, and adjectives and nouns are never lenited after a feminine noun in the genitive case.
Examples: leabhar na máthara móire
Teach na mná deise

quote:

I think the reason a lot of people get confused about that is because it's an adjective following the feminine breith, although breithlá is masculine.

We see such things as "breith Chríost" so I'm suggesting that there is a reason for the lenition. I'm not saying that it's correct, merely offering it as an explanation why we see both versions.

A person who knows Irish well will know how things like that work. eg:

an áit bheag
ainm na háite bige

an bhreith shona
lá na breithe sona

breith shona
lá breithe sona

If you make a mistake there, well... your grammar's just lacking.

Is fíor d'Aonghus go bhfeictear/gcloistear "shona" go minic, agus is fíor do Lughaidh go bhfuil sé sin mícheart. Ní hé seo an chéad uair a pléadh an cheist seo. Ach... there comes a point at which an error becomes an exception, má ghlactar leis go forleathan. Ní dóigh liom go bhfuilimid ag an bpointe sin fós, áfach. Idir an dá linn, scríobhfaidh mé "lá breithe sona".

Ceist: an féidir "lá breithe shona" a chur i gcomparáid le "ag fáil bháis"?

The original request was for a translation to be printed on a birthday card so, because it's for a "formal" occassion and will be committed to print, I withdraw my earlier suggestion re Lá breithe shona duit.

Ceist: an féidir "lá breithe shona" a chur i gcomparáid le "ag fáil bháis"?

It isn't possible. There is a séimhiú on "bháis" in the phrase "ag fáil bháis" because in older grammar, fáil (as well as any verbal noun) is in the dative case after "ag", and in older grammar, what follows a word in the dative singular has a séimhiú on it. It is still true in Donegal Irish, and especially in older speakers' language (seanchaithe, etc). But after a verbal noun preceded by "ag", the séimhiú has been lost in today language in most dialects and in the standard, except in a few phrases like "ag fáil bháis", "ag gabháil fhoinn" and one of two other expressions like that.

So, nothing in common with *lá breithe shona", that has no reason for any séimhiú, even in the older language...

(Message edited by lughaidh on December 08, 2005)

I'm no saineolaí teanga by any stretch of the imagination, but I agree with Lughaidh on this point. I myself think that this "séimhiú" might have sneaked in as a result of the widespread use of "Nollaig Shona" and it just gets aspirated for anything and everything as a result.

Mind you...can anyone shed any light on the Obair Baile or Obair Bhaile debate...?

Obair baile is what the native speakers use. We have a native speaker in our local school and the use of "obair bhaile" by the other teachers is a bit strange to her.

I've never heard anything other than "obair" being feminine:

an obair shuimiúil
tús na hoibre suimiúla
na hoibreacha suimiúla
tús na n-oibreacha suimiúla

Thanks for all your help. I'm sure the recipient will be pleased.

Fear na mBróg --> I have heard that there was a difference between obair bhaile and obair baile. One means "homework" (for school), the other one means "the work you have to do at home, like to sweep dust, etc. I don't remember which one is which one. Maybe obair bhaile = sweeping etc and obair baile = school work.

Obair is always feminine; sometimes there are exceptions to the rule of séimhiú on a noun that is after a feminine noun in the nominative case, cf tír mór = the continent (or Ireland, as opposed to the small Irish isles, like Tory, the Aran isles, etc), although tír is feminine.

I understand that "obair" is feminine, a Fhear na mBro/g. But if you were to shoot every native speaker in Donegal for saying "obair baile" there'd be none left...

Feminine nouns don't always cause aspiration on the next word...but most of the exceptions have an explanation. However, I haven't been able to find an explanation for "obair baile" yet...

I've heard that explanation before too Lughaidh, that "obair baile" is school homework and that "obair bhaile" is housework. I have only heard this from people who have attended a particular college under a particular lecturer...I don't think native speakers are generally aware of the distinction. Obair tí is what I normally hear for housework...interestingly there's no séimhiú on that either.

I see Ó Do/naill has "obair bhaile" for homework...

"I withdraw my earlier suggestion re Lá breithe shona duit."
CGL - If you're a Caighdeán Oifigiúil Slut stick without the H

But personally i have never heard any Gaeigeoir *Before today* write it/ say it without the h

I also think it's much harder to say for the mouth of the Gael..

I'll be a non-caighdeán slag and stick with the Gaeilge Bhriste! ;)

But personally i have never heard any Gaeigeoir *Before today* write it/ say it without the h

Cé hiad na Gaeilgeoirí a chuala tú? Sin a’ cheist.

I also think it's much harder to say for the mouth of the Gael..

Chan fheicim cad chuige a mbeadh sé níos casta le fuaimniú ! Lá breithe sona / *Lá breithe shona.

Is féidir le béal Ghaeil rudaí i bhfad níos casta ná sin a dh’fhuaimniú !

Cúpla sampla, a Lughaidh

http://www.dingle-region.com/irishlanguage.htm

https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9902&L=gaelic-l&T=0&F=&S=&P=7331

Táim réasúnta cinnte gur chuala mé "lá breithe shona" ar chursa Gaeilge na blianta ó shin -- an cúrsa a tháinig le leabhrán tanaí déanta as nuachtpháipéar, an ceann a raibh sleachta fada air de chainteoirí líofa ag caint faoi chuile rud faoin ngréin. Cén t-ainm atá air?

A Aonghuis, ar an tsuíomh fán Daingean, ní Gaeilg an Daingin atá ann ach Gaeilg chaighdeánach (is iomaí abairt nach n-abróchaí ar a’ dóigh sin i Mumhain: conas atá tú --> conas atánn tú, i Mumhain; feicfidh mé --> cífead, i Mumhain, srl). Mar sin ní cinnte gur cainteoir dúchais a rinn é.

Cibé ar bith, is féidir go ndéantar meancóg ins an abairt sin siocair nach abairt nádúrtha atá ann ar chor ar bith, níl ann ach aistriúchán don abairt Bhéarla agus fadó, tá mé cinnte nach ndéanfaí ceiliúradh ar bith nuair a bhí do lá breithe ann. Mar sin is dóigh liom nach n-úsáidfí ’n abairt sin fadó agus ní óna muintir a d’fhoghlaim bunadh na Gaeltachta í ach ó na meáin nó ó rud ineacht eile. D’fhoghlaim siad í mar a chuala siad í, agus ar a’ drochuair tá meancóg inti...

Is dócha gurbh fíor dhuit. "Cothrom lae mo bhreithe" atá ar Birthday.

Nílim ach ag rá go bhfuil an dá leagan fairsing.

About "grammarians" and English grammar:

quote:

He left school. Look at that sentence -- "school" is in the singular. When something is in the singular, if it's the definite article, it's preceeded by "the"; if it's the indefinite article, it's preceeded by "a"... but this has neither! It's grammatically wrong! But still no-one complains... not even a grammarian!

Grammarians don't complain because there is nothing grammatically incorrect here...

"school" in that sentence does not refer to any specific educational building. It refers to the system of education.

He left his school - the particular building in which he was educated.

He left a (the) school - the particular establishment at which he was educated, without specifying the name of the school/building.

He left school - he finished his education.

Each of these 3 sentences is grammatically correct, a chara...

It refers to the system of education.

What about "he goes to school every morning".
In this sentence, "school" can refer to the/an educational building.
English, unlike French, can choose not to use an article in order to express non-specificity. Despite what one may think, "a" and "the" in English do add specificity. In French for instance, the definite article is much less specific, since "he goes to school" cannot be translated otherwise than "il va à l'école".

What I meant to say is that "school", in that sentence, is an abstract noun. As such, it's grammatically correct to omit the article.

My point is : which of the chicken and the egg comes first...

Either the noun is abstract, therefore you use no article, or you use no article, therefore the noun becomes abstract... (or maybe both)

Anyway... as long as we agree on the "correctness" of the sentence...

Yes, we certainly agree on that point.