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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 2005- » 2005 (November-December) » Archive through December 23, 2005 » Number of Irish speakers « Previous Next »

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Rómán (Unregistered Guest)
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Posted on Friday, December 02, 2005 - 09:05 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Disclaimer: this is my way of thinking, you are welcome to constructively criticise it, but no reason to start flame.

Yesterday I took a look at 2002 Census data and the fact which drew my attention was the number of daily speakers of Irish - 339 541. Not bad I would say, but then I thought about those pesky schoolchidren whose "daily" Gaelainn consists of "May I go to WC, M'am" (as Gaeilge of course). So I started sifting the data. But before I start - some of my assumptions.
  • only daily speakers are considered, I find it hillarious that someone claiming to be Gaeilgeoir can never speak Gaelainn. Even those speaking less than once a week make me laugh - you lose language skills very fast with such type of practice
  • the whole country is divided into Galltacht and Gaeltacht as it is obvious that returned rates of daily speaking are incomparable between them
  • it is assumed (maybe too conservatively) that the proportion of schoolchildren (5-19 d'aois) genuinely speaking Irish is generally the same as proportion of their parents speaking Gaelainn


And these my results(% of daily speakers of total age group):
Aois 3-4 5-9 10-14 15-19 20-24 25-34 35-44 45-54 55-64 65's os a chionn
Galltacht 4.67% 31.22% 37.12% 21.19% 2.36% 1.76% 2.20% 2.31% 1.77% 1.15%
Gaeltacht 36.81% 61.62% 62.93% 48.34% 26.48% 26.77% 29.88% 34.65% 36.93% 40.81%


Short comment: it is obvious from the numbers that
  • school is skewing usage of language both in Gaeltacht as in Galltacht
  • language is deteriorating is Gaeltacht as every new generation is speaking less and less
  • alternatively the language is taking ground outside of Gaeltacht
  • especially warming is the fact that proportion of 3-4 years' olds speaking is significantly bigger than of those above 20


So after taking those "pesky" schoolchildren out. I came with such a table (only daoine 3 bliana d'aois agus os a chionn):
Contaepopulationdaily Gaeilgeoirí%
Laighin2013871252991.26%
Ceatharlach438808812.01%
Baile Átha Cliath107798087550.81%
Cathar BÁC47846814860.31%
Dún Laoghaire-Ráth an Dúin18496432761.77%
Fine Gall18702820841.11%
BÁC Theas22752020510.90%
Cill Dara15540035922.31%
Cill Channigh7690320452.66%
Laois5595612092.16%
An Longfort296797722.60%
966876830.71%
An Mhí12725730912.43%
Uíbh Fhailí607878571.41%
An Iarmhí684638031.17%
Loch Garman11138511201.01%
Cill Mhantáin10949417381.59%
Mumha1055183420213.98%
An Clár9869246554.72%
Corcaigh429341163643.81%
Cathar Corcaí11900928042.36%
Contae Corcaí310332136424.40%
Ciarraí12751876085.97%
Luimneach16829755083.27%
Cathar Luimnigh5177311462.21%
Contae Luimnigh11652443783.76%
Tiobraid Árann Thuaidh5839527804.76%
Tiobraid Árann Theas7579620842.75%
Port Láirge9714430293.12%
Cathar Phort Láirge426455551.30%
Contae Phort Láirge5449924954.58%
Connachta445972253105.68%
Gallimh200567184389.19%
Cathar na Gallimhe6350319583.08%
Contae na Gallimhe1370641671612.20%
Liatroim248126902.78%
Maigh Eo11284341693.69%
Ros Comáin5175513512.61%
Sligeach5599510161.81%
Ulaidh (cuid de)235969116394.93%
An Cabhán541088041.49%
Dún na nGall13139392687.05%
Muineachán5046817333.43%
An Stát37509951031352.75%

My comment:
  • total number of genuine speakers is around 100 000 people. Not as high as 1.5 mln of self reported "speakers", but nevertheless higher than total number of Gaeltacht inhabitants - 86 ths
  • the most Irish-speaking county is Contae na Gallimhe
  • biggest number of speakers is in Mumhain
  • BÁC is not the biggest "Gaeltacht" as it is sometimes claimed


A discussion is welcome.

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 2608
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Friday, December 02, 2005 - 04:59 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

quote:

BÁC is not the biggest "Gaeltacht" as it is sometimes claimed



It depends on what is meant. Your figures show that it is the town with the largest number of daily speakers, although the percentage is small. It also has a larger number than all gaeltacht areas - which is what is usually meant by the claim. (Cathair Bhaile Átha Cliath, as an administrative area, is much smaller than the built up area which is what is meant by the claim. All the areas in Italics in county dublin are built up)

But it is anyway not a meaningful claim, since those ~8000 speakers are too thinly spread to count as a "pobal", rather they are a number of occasionally interacting networks.

What is usually meant by comparing the relative strengths of gaeltacht areas is the percentage of the local population who are daily speakers.

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Róman (Unregistered Guest)
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Posted on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 12:42 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

I've got more detailed data - and data of 1996 census for comparison. There are some reasons to cheer - witness success of Irish in reclaiming some space in and around Gaillimh, as well as in Dún na nGall. But Gaelainn na Mumhan faces extinction I am afraid to say. BÁC is also losing Gaeilge speakers as whole East Ulster and Laghin.
Cúige19962002change
Laighin4481344190-623
Ceatharlach1136976-160
Baile Átha Cliath2374423470-274
Cathair BÁC92089311103
Dún Laoghaire-Ráth an Dúin49404715-225
Fine Gall4078415678
BÁC Theas55185288-230
Cill Dara37153899184
Cill Chainnigh1705172722
Laois12751148-127
An Longfort694630-64
21191926-193
An Mhí31943450256
Uíbh Fhailí12901157-133
An Iarmhí15131369-144
Loch Garman22252121-104
Cill Mhantáin22032317114
Mumha3184330462-1381
An Clár26492602-47
Corcaigh1229111471-820
Cathair Chorcaí32132647-566
Contae Chorcaí90788824-254
Ciarraí6461655695
Luimneach42493923-326
Cathair Luimnigh12881137-151
Contae Luimnigh29612786-175
Tiobraid Árann Thuaidh17451629-116
Tiobraid Árann Theas17231578-145
Port Láirge27252703-22
Cathair Phort Láirge79982223
Contae Phort Láirge19261881-45
Connachta27594292751681
Gaillimh19376214612085
Cathair na Gaillimhe33984078680
Contae na Gallimhe15978173831405
Liatroim560534-26
Maigh Eo51644983-181
Ros Comáin11561084-72
Sligeach13381213-125
Ulaidh (cuid de)1617317002829
An Cabhán11201113-7
Dún na nGall1369114565874
Muineachán13621324-38
An Stát120423120929506


REMINDER: the table depicts number of daily speakers in each county eliminating schoolchildren whose "daily" speaking is confined to the walls of the school.

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Lughaidh
Member
Username: Lughaidh

Post Number: 1173
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 07:33 am:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Anois ba mhaith liom a fhios a bheith agam cá mhéid cainteoirí dúchais Gaeltachta atá in Eirinn, agus cá háit a bhfuil a' chuid is mó daofa. Ach tá eagla orm nach dtearnadh suirbhé air sin.

Tír Chonaill abú!

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Domhnall
Member
Username: Domhnall

Post Number: 393
Registered: 06-2005


Posted on Sunday, December 18, 2005 - 04:48 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Timpeall is 25,000 ar fhad is atá ar eolas agam. Tír Chonaill an áit is láidire. Gaillimh sa dara háit.

A people without a language of its own is only half a nation.A nation should guard its language more than its territories, 'tis a surer barrier and a more important frontier than mountain or river

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Dalta
Member
Username: Dalta

Post Number: 9
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Monday, December 19, 2005 - 08:21 pm:   Small TextLarge TextEdit Post Print Post

Dúirt an comisiúin sin a rinneadh don Roinn Oideachas go bhfuil 62,000 daoine sa Ghaeltacht ag úsáid Gaeilge go laethúil, sin suas ó 61,000 an bhlian seo caite.

Maidir leis na figiúirí, ní cheapaim nach bhfuil ach 40% de dhaoine os comhar 65 ina nGaeilgeoirí sa Ghaeltacht, gach duine a chonaic mé i gConamara os comhar 40 bhí Gaeilge in úsáid aige/aici.



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