I Thought I had Ó Siadhail's explanation of the particle "go" and adjectives down. But I'm a bit confused.

We have:

Tá an leaba go maith. (with 'go')

Then, there is:

Tá bia maith anseo. (without 'go')

Is the deciding factor the presence of the adverb 'anseo'?

--------------------

So, is it: Tá Bríd mhaith.
or: Tá Bríd go maith.

And, if it's 'Tá Bríd mhaith,' why do we have 'Tá sí go maith'?

Tá an leaba go maith = the bed is good (Is the bed [go] good)

Tá bia maith anseo = there is good food here. (Is food good here)

In the second sentence you couldn’t have "go" before the adjective.

Tá Bríd maith = Tá Bríd go maith = Bríd is good. ("go" can be omitted in many sentences)

Tá Bríd mhaith --> the lenition of "maith" shows that "maith" goes together with Bríd and so the sentence means "good Bríd is"... which doesn't mean anything.
You have to put another item so that the sentence is right: Tá Bríd mhaith anseo = good Bríd is here.

If there is a lenition on an adjective, it means that it is in the same group as the preceding word:

[Tá] [Bríd mhaith] anseo. = [good Bríd] [is] [here]
But: [Tá] [Bríd] [(go) maith]. = [Bríd] [is] [good]

Hope it is clear !

quote:

Tá an leaba go maith. (with 'go')

Then, there is:

Tá bia maith anseo. (without 'go')

In the first instance, "go maith" is a predicate adjective. In the second, "maith" is an attributive adjective. English examples:

attributive: big boy, bad girl

predicate: The boy is big. The girl is bad.

Funny, look at the grammar terms in French and English:

attributive adjective = adjectif épithète

predicate adjective = adjectif attribut

Have to be careful so that I don't get mixed up!


Anyway, does the average English speaker know these terms "attributive adjective" and "predicate adjective" or not?

Quote: "Anyway, does the average English speaker know these terms "attributive adjective" and "predicate adjective" or not?"

Not by a long shot. I would say not one in a hundred can label the constructs despite the fact that everyone uses them regularly. Moreover, the labels have nothing to do with effective speech.

Does the average speaker of any language know the terms for the constructs? They are learned in school but I daresay that most people leave the terms at the classroom door.

I think this is what the original poster was getting at:

"go" is used for adverbs, thus you have:

I painted the wall bluely. (Bear with me!)
Phéinteáil mé an balla go gorm.

But:

Tá an balla gorm.
The wall is blue.

Note that "go" was only used for the adverb and not for the simple adjective.

But then we have:

Tá an bia go maith

which makes no sense whatsoever. Well... there's no explanation for this, other than that certain ajectives use "go" even when they're not an adverb. Fortunately though, there's only eight of them:

Tá an bia go maith
Tá an bia go breá
Tá an bia go deas
Tá an bia go dona
Tá an bia go haoibhinn
Tá an bia go hiontach
Tá an bia go hálainn
Tá an bia go holc

But everywhere else you have:

Tá an bia gorm
Tá an bia salach
Tá an bia suimiúil
Tá an bia cainteach

Note though that you don't use "go" when you're simply writing an adjective after a noun (eg. a blue wall):

Cailín álainn atá inti.
Lá breá atá ann.
Buachaill maith atá ann.

Thanks, everyone!

All great explanations. I wish there were an Irish grammar book that explained this in more depth (as you all did). As good as Ó Siadhail's book is... it's still not quite as complete as, say a good Spanish grammar book is (of course, Spanish grammar is so much easier!). Is there a comprehensive grammar-based text out there for Irish? ...I'm talking about one that REALLY digs into the rules and would be a good reference for such questions. In English, there are many such "grammar handbooks."

As for the comment on the typical English speaker and English grammar: No, for the most part, the populous hasn't a clue concerning the mechanics. Better speakers, of course, know when it's right and when it's wrong--but they typically aren't aware of the details as to why something works the way it does. I'm a writer, and I seldom worry about the parts of speach and such. I do have reference when needed, and I know what these grammatical terms mean, but I rarely diagram a sentence and pick it apart. It either "sounds" right or it doesn't. I suspect it is that way for most other native speakers of various languages as well.
And yes, when I was in school, they drilled us very hard on all of the mechanical aspects of the English language. I seldom think about it anymore, though.

BTW, Lughaidh...

Your explanation of lenition and 'grouping' of words REALLY turned on some lights. I hadn't thought of it like that. I was thinking the reason for lenition was more along the lines of the spoken word. Your idea actually gives a logical reason for lenition in the first place.
At least in my mind.
(Message edited by Chris_C on December 02, 2005)

(Message edited by Chris_C on December 02, 2005)

>>Well... there's no explanation for this, other than that certain ajectives use "go" even when they're not an adverb. Fortunately though, there's only eight of them:

I don't see why we couldn't analyze them as used adverbially.
(The fact that it doesn't happen in English really means nothing.)

quote:

I don't see why we couldn't analyze them as used adverbially.
(The fact that it doesn't happen in English really means nothing.)

The adjectives involved (FnaB's list, plus sometimes "go huafásach") all involve good/bad value judgments. In English, we do have "well" as an adverb (He did it well) and as a predicate adjective (He was sick, but now he's well).