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Djwebb2002
Member Username: Djwebb2002
Post Number: 58 Registered: 07-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 05:19 pm: |
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Is this a combination of Cé and an? I can't find Cén in Dinneen's dictionary, but Cé exists. It also says to see Cia, where "where" is given as Cia (an) áit? |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 792 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 05:21 pm: |
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Cén is a combination of cé + an. |
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 2061 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 05:22 pm: |
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Sea. cén cé2 + an. cé [mír cheisteach] cad é an duine nó an rud (cé hé sin? cén chaoi a bhfuil tú?). cé acu (cén ceann nó duine díobh (cé acu is fearr leat? níl a fhios agam cé acu)). cén chaoi (conas). cén dóigh (conas). |
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Lars
Member Username: Lars
Post Number: 17 Registered: 08-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 05:40 pm: |
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Dinneen's "cia" is an old form of "cé". |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 794 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 05:43 pm: |
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Cia, from Old Irish cía; Welsh pwy, Breton piv... Latin quis... |
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Lars
Member Username: Lars
Post Number: 19 Registered: 08-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 06:44 pm: |
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... and from Proto-Indoeuropean *kwi :-) Lars |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 797 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 06:49 pm: |
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Common Celtic, something like *k(w)ê, i'd say. |
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Lars
Member Username: Lars
Post Number: 21 Registered: 08-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 07:24 pm: |
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Common Celtic, according to Lewis/Pedersen (Concise Comparative Celtic Grammar): *kuei (*kuoi?) BTW:Breton is piou in this book. Lars |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 799 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 08:01 pm: |
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*k(w)ei et *k(w)oi must be older forms than *k(w)ê. I gave *k(w)ê because Gaelic -ia- as a cognate to Welsh -wy-, Breton -oe-, -oa- come from older long -ê-'s. Breton has several spellings. Piv and piou are the very same word. The first one is in the Peurunvan (=Unified) spelling, the second (the one you gave) is in the Skolveurieg (=Universitary) spelling. There are other spellings like piw and più, for example. Nowadays, "piv" is the most used spelling. (I speak Breton fluently, so... ). |
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Lars
Member Username: Lars
Post Number: 22 Registered: 08-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 08:28 pm: |
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I don't speak Breton at all, I must say. My impression is that the spelling "piv" looks better ("piou", esp. "ou" looks almost like being French). But, AFAIR, I saw lots of "ou" in Breton words, so "piou" seems to be more familiar to me. Are they pronounced the same? /pju/, /piu/, /piv/ or /piw/? > I speak Breton fluently, so... ). Oh, I wish I could say that of any other language than German ... Lars |
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Djwebb2002
Member Username: Djwebb2002
Post Number: 60 Registered: 07-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 08:30 pm: |
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(I speak Breton fluently, so... ). Lughaidh, let me finish your sentence for you: I speak Breton fluently, so don't argue!! :-):-) |
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Djwebb2002
Member Username: Djwebb2002
Post Number: 61 Registered: 07-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 08:31 pm: |
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Lars your English seems fluent. I had assumed you were Swedish though, not German. |
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Lughaidh
Member Username: Lughaidh
Post Number: 800 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 08:47 pm: |
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>My impression is that the spelling "piv" looks better ("piou", esp. "ou" looks almost like being French). >But, AFAIR, I saw lots of "ou" in Breton words, >so "piou" seems to be more familiar to me. >Are they pronounced the same? /pju/, /piu/, /piv/ >or /piw/? The pronounciation depends on dialect: Breton is the Celtic language that has the biggest number of dialectal variants. Let's say some of the pronounciations: [pif],[piw], [piy], [pju], [pi], [piu]... |
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Lars
Member Username: Lars
Post Number: 23 Registered: 08-2005
| Posted on Saturday, September 24, 2005 - 09:27 pm: |
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> Lars your English seems fluent. Go raibh maith agat. Ach, mhuise, is fusa scríobh ná labhairt ... > I had assumed you were Swedish though, not German. Ó, cén fáth? Mar gheall ar m'ainmse, b'fhéidir? Ach ní hea, ní Sualannach mé. Is coitianta an t-ainm é "Lars" i nGearmáin inniu, go háirithe ar na daoine óga. (Ach b'ainm annamh é sin san am ar rugadh mé, caithfidh mé a rá i bhfabhar mo thuismitheoirí ... ) Lars |
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Aonghus
Member Username: Aonghus
Post Number: 2065 Registered: 08-2004
| Posted on Sunday, September 25, 2005 - 05:20 pm: |
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