A chairde,

I'm giving a shot a learning "Donncha Bán."
So far, so good. But I'm having a trouble with two lines in particular. The version I've been working from is on Mary Staunton's wonderful CD, Bright Early Morning. There are many verses to the song: Mary sings 5 of them in her version.

Is ar an mbaile seo chonaic sibh an t-ionadh
Ar Dhonncha Bán is é á dhaoradh,
Bhí caipín bán air in áit a hata,
Is róipín cnáibe in áit a charabhata.

Tá mé ag teacht ar feadh na hoíche
Mar bheadh uainín i measc seilbh mhóir caorach,
Mo bhrollach foscailte ‘s mo cheann liom scaoilte,
‘S cá bhfaighinn mo dheartháirín romham ach sínte!

Chaoin mé an chéad dreas ag gob a’ locha,
‘S an dara dreas ag bun do chroiche,
An tríú dreas ag ceann do choirp-se,
I measc na nGall ‘s mo cheann á scoilteadh.

A Dhonncha Bháin, a dheartháirín dílis,
Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú;
Ag ól an chupáin, ag deargadh an phíopa
‘S ag siúl an drúchta le com na hoíche.


Tá spré Dhonncha Bháin ag tíocht abhaile
Agus ní ba, caoirigh é ná capaill,
Ach tobac ‘s píopaí ‘s coinnle geala,
‘S ní dá mhaíomh é ar lucht a gcaite.

Honestly, I've labored with my big dictionary, but I've hit a roadblock with the following:

Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú
[It's well that I know...??]

and

‘S ní dá mhaíomh é ar lucht a gcaite.

I very much appreciate that people share their knowledge so generously. This forum has played an important role
in my study of Irish.

Le meas, Paul

Hi Paul,

> Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú
> [It's well that I know...??]

"... that (thing?) yonder which took you from me."

I'm not entirely clear what "siúd" refers to. Is she talking about his carousing habits (drinking, smoking, and walking out after dark ("le coim na hóiche") that eventually caused his downfall?


> ‘S ní dá mhaíomh é ar lucht a gcaite.

dá/dhá/á mhaíomh = begrudging it

"And not begrudging it (tobac & píopaí at the wake) to the people who consume them (lit. of their consuming)"

Dennis, a chara,

Thanks. I think it would help if I posted the entire song,
which comes from a "Songs of 1798" website. Rath was nice enough to post these lyrics on this forum several months ago. Perhaps the entire song will help to provide the context for those lines...

Also, in the line "Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú," Mary Staunton uses the word "ceard" in place of "siúd."



DONNCHA BÁN
Fuair Edward Bunting an t-amhrán seo i gCúige Chonnacht. Deirtear gur thaitin an fonn le Máire Nic Reachtain, deirfiúr Henry Joe McCracken, a crochadh freisin.
***


Is ar an mbaile seo chonaic sibh an t-ionadh
Ar Dhonncha Bán is é á dhaoradh,
Bhí caipín bán air in áit a hata,
Is róipín cnáibe in áit a charabhata.

Tá mé ag teacht ar feadh na hoíche
Mar bheadh uainín i measc seilbh mhóir caorach,
Mo bhrollach foscailte ‘s mo cheann liom scaoilte,
‘S cá bhfaighinn mo dheartháirín romham ach sínte!

Chaoin mé an chéad dreas ag gob a’ locha,
‘S an dara dreas ag bun do chroiche,
An tríú dreas ag ceann do choirp-se,
I measc na nGall ‘s mo cheann á scoilteadh.

Dá mbeifeá agamsa san áit ar chóir duit,
Thíos i Sligeach nó i mBaile an Róba,
Bhrisfí an chroch, ghearrfaí an rópa,
‘S ligfí Donncha Bán abhaile ar an eolas.

A Dhonncha Bháin níorbh é an chroch ba dhual duit,
Ach dul chuig an scioból ‘s d’easair a bhualadh,
An céachta d’iompú, deiseal’s tuathal
‘S an taobh dhearg den fhód a chur in uachtar.

A Dhonncha Bháin, a dheartháirín dílis,
Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú;
Ag ól an chupáin, ag deargadh an phíopa
‘S ag siúl an drúchta le com na hoíche.

A Mhic Uí Mhultháin, a sciúrsa an mhí-ádh
Ní lao bó bradaí a bhí in mo dheartáir,
Ach buachaillín cruinn-deas ar chnoc ‘s ar chnocán
A bhainfeadh fuaim go bog binn as camán.

‘S a Dhonncha Bháin nach é sin an buaireadh
Agus ‘fheabhas is d’iomprófá spoir is buatais!
Chuirfinn éadach faiseanta ort, den éadach ba bhuaine,
Agus chuirfinn amach thú mar mhac duine uasial.

A Mhic Uí Mhultháin! ná raibh do chlann mhac i bhfochair a chéile,
Ná do chlann iníon ag iarraidh spré ort!
Tá dhá cheann an chláir folamh, ‘s an t-urlár líonta,
Is Donncha Bán, mo dheartháirín, sínte.

Tá spré Dhonncha Bháin ag tíocht abhaile
Agus ní ba, caoirigh é ná capaill,
Ach tobac ‘s píopaí ‘s coinnle geala,
‘S ní dá mhaíomh é ar lucht a gcaite.
Ó mBéalaoideas

Thanks, Dennis, and anyone else who can help me with this.

Le meas, Paul

siúd in this case "that which"

quote:

Is she talking about his carousing habits (drinking, smoking, and walking out after dark ("le coim na hóiche") that eventually caused his downfall?

I think so. bad company leading him to getting hanged.

Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú

I know very well who it was that took you from me

"siúd" I presume is sort of an abbreviation of "iad siúd", just like you have "sin" instead of "é sin"?

Just to clarify something: As far as I know, when you stick "siúd" after a pronoun, it's the same as using the emphasised form, eg>

Is maith atá a fhios agam iadsan a bhain díom thú
=
Is maith atá a fhios agam iad siúd a bhain díom thú

An bhfuil an ceart agam?

(Message edited by Fear_na_mBróg on August 21, 2005)

That f-uckin poem was on the leaving cert (State exam you do before college in Ireland) higher level..
The siúd refers to the english b-astards and if i remember correctly the local sherriff who were the reason for him being dead..

And that poem came up on the bloody exam and it was the difference between me getting A1 and an A2 ;(

I swear poems like that are why no-one can speak Gaeilge and why some ppl hold grudges.. I hope Minister Hanafin cops herself on soon!

A Dhomhnaill,

How about you cop yourself on and realise when and when not it's appropriate to use bad language? The use of hyphen doesn't deter much from one's interpretation of your sentences.

Is maith atá ‘s agam siúd a bhain díom thú
[It's well that I know...??]

is maith atá fios agam siúd a bhain díom thú

it is well known by me that from there you were taken from me by them.

cosuil le bruach na carraige baine

mar is maith atá fhios ag ma chomhrasín.

possibly formulaic type see also feile ruin o for the use of suid. mattie jo sheamuis o flathara

>it is well known by me that from there you were taken >from me by them.

why "by them"? It is siúd, not siad

>is maith atá a fhios agam siúd a bhain díom thú

= I know well what has taken you from me.

Siúd means "that thing over there".

Tá leagan eile den amhrán sin agamsa, agus gan 'siúd' ann. Leagan Ulltach is ea é. Tá sé go han-álainn. Ní dhearna Domhnacha aon rud mícheart, nó ní deirtear sin san amhrán ar aon nós.
I have another version of that son, without 'siúd' in it. It's an Ulster verson. It's very beautiful. Dennis didn't do anything wrong, or at least it isn't said that he did in the song.
'cad é 'bhain díom thú' atá ann, sílim.
It has...I think.

Brian O Domhnaill, "Donnchadh Ban," CD:
"Seachran Si," Clo Iar-Chonnachta
le cloisteáil mar chuid den chlár raidió seo:
to be heard as part of this radio show:
http://wfuv.venaca.com/archive/3588.asx
Seo an playlist: http://www.wfuv.org/wfuv/playlists/mil031004.html

Tá aistriúchán deas ann sa leabhrán atá infillte leis an DD sin.
There is a nice translation in the booklet that is enclosed with the CD.

A Fhir na mbróg,

"How about you cop yourself on and realise when and when not it's appropriate to use bad language? The use of hyphen doesn't deter much from one's interpretation of your sentences."

OOOOOOOooohhhh bhuel mo leithscéal!!! Dont lay a f-uckin egg like.. U not think you're loosing the noodle over nothing a phota?
Usáidfidh mé aon fhocail a bheidh de dhíth orm ach go raibh míle ar aon nós as ucht do mholadh! Má theastaíonn uait an teanga salach sin a úsáid tá tú saor chun é sin a dhéanamh, má theastaíonn uaim f-uck nó aon fhocail eile dá leithéid a úsáid bainfidh mé úsáid astu ;)

* IS FEARR GAEILGE BRISTE NA GAEILGE CLISTE *

A chairde,
Thanks for all the help with this.

Le meas,
Paul

From the imbecilic mouth of Domhnall:

quote:

OOOOOOOooohhhh bhuel mo leithscéal!!! Dont lay a f-uckin egg like.. U not think you're loosing the noodle over nothing a phota?
Usáidfidh mé aon fhocail a bheidh de dhíth orm ach go raibh míle ar aon nós as ucht do mholadh! Má theastaíonn uait an teanga salach sin a úsáid tá tú saor chun é sin a dhéanamh, má theastaíonn uaim f-uck nó aon fhocail eile dá leithéid a úsáid bainfidh mé úsáid astu ;)

* IS FEARR GAEILGE BRISTE NA GAEILGE CLISTE *

More vacuous tripe out of you. The reason I complained is that your imbecilic posts drags down the entire quality of this forum, and it reflects on all of us.

How about you brush up on your writing skills, then tour Europe for a year or so and cop yourself on, then return and try fit into a civilised society, assuming of course you've no mental disabilities preventing you from doing so.