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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2004 (October-December) » Archive through October 30, 2004 » Ceist eile..... « Previous Next »

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Celtoid
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Username: Celtoid

Post Number: 36
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 - 08:00 am:   Edit Post Print Post

"...shíl sé nach raibh sé in arraíocht a dhéanta le a raibh ar bord aige-sláinte 'ár n-aíonna'."

I'm confused about "a dhéanta". Why is there a verbal partical before a verbal adjective? Am I missing something?

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Fear_na_mbróg
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Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 191
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 - 08:21 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Well I can't explain "le a raibh", that should be all counts be "lena raibh".

As for "arraíocht a dhéanta", perhaps that's an alternate form of "arraíocht a dhéanaimh"?

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 318
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, October 19, 2004 - 09:07 am:   Edit Post Print Post

He believed he was not able to do it given how much he had on board (i.e. he had drunk too much).

The phrase is "in arraíocht a dhéanta"

I can't deconstruct the grammar for you; but hopefully the translation will help.

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Celtoid
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Username: Celtoid

Post Number: 37
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, October 21, 2004 - 08:08 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I don't think that's correct, a Aonghuis. Here's more of the sentence: "...ghair an t-sagart an tsláinte ba chóir dó a fhágáil faoi fhear an tí, murach gur shíl sé nach raibh sé in arraíocht a dhéanta le a raibh ar bord aige-sláinte 'ár n-aíonna'."

The priest proposed the toast that was proper for him as man of the house, because it didn't appear to have been done by any of those that he had at the table - a toast to the guests.

Is that correct?

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 325
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, October 21, 2004 - 08:59 am:   Edit Post Print Post

No. Albert (or was it Alfred) is proposing the toast his father should be proposing, becuase he thinks he is drunk.

The priest proposed the toast, which he ought to have left to the householder, were it not that he (the priest) thought that he (the householder) would not be able to with the amount of drink he (the householder) had taken - the health of "our guests"

Basically the prospect of finally going home has driven our hero somewhat wild, and he has reverted to his wild Irish ways, to the scandal of his Americanised children, who try to hush him into a corner!

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Celtoid
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Username: Celtoid

Post Number: 38
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 22, 2004 - 07:55 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Go raibh maith agat, a Aonghuis.

déanta - genitive singular form of "déanamh" (as verbal noun).

"in arraíocht a dhéanta" - in fitness, strength of his doing (able to do it).

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Fear_na_mbróg
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Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 205
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 22, 2004 - 09:55 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Celtoid, where did you get that from?

I suggested it as a guess, but could not find anything to back it up!

The only genetive singular form of "déanamh" of which I'm aware is "déanaimh".

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 330
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 22, 2004 - 10:03 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I don't think "a" in this case means his.
I think "in arraíocht a dhéanta" means
"in power of doing" (Which looks crazy in English, but OK in Irish).

What we have, I belive is:
a [mír choibhneasta dhíreach]
mír choibhneasta dhíreach (an té a chuireann an síol; an cat a d'ól an bainne; an síol a cuireadh san earrach).

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Lúcas
Member
Username: Lúcas

Post Number: 27
Registered: 01-2004


Posted on Saturday, October 23, 2004 - 12:08 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

FnaB, Aonghus

Seo dhuit cupla focal faoi Tuiseal Ginideach Ainm Bhriathartha ón Gramaiméar Gaeilge na mBráithe Críostaí:

Deilbhíocht an Ainm Bhriathartha


...
An Ginideach
17.8 Má tá cuspóir (ainmfhocal nó aidiacht shealbhach) ag gabháil leis an ainm briathartha san abairt (i.e. más le briathar aistreach a bhaineann sé), is ionann foirm an ghinidigh agus foirm na haidiachta briathartha go hiondúil: lucht ceannaithe na mbeithíoch; fear inste scéil; lá íoctha na rátaí; modh a húsáidte; in ann a dhéanta; chun a gcrochta; ar tí mo mharaithe.

Ach ní rómhinic a úsáidtear leaganacha den sórt thuas. Mar shampla, is túisce a déarfaí ceannaí muc, tógálaithe tithefear ceannaithe muc, lucht tógála (tógtha) tithe.


An Gúm, ISBN 1-857791-327-2, 1999, lch. 195, 196.

Féach ar an shampla ainm briathartha thios, in ann a dhéanta.
(Message edited by lúcas on October 23, 2004)

(Message edited by lúcas on October 23, 2004)

(Message edited by lúcas on October 23, 2004)

Mise le meas,

Lúcas

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Celtoid
Member
Username: Celtoid

Post Number: 39
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Sunday, October 24, 2004 - 07:41 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A Fhear na mBróg, fuair mé é sin as m'fhoclóir (Ó Dónaill).

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 337
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, October 26, 2004 - 04:41 am:   Edit Post Print Post

GRMA, a Lúcais. Bhí fhios agam go raibh cúis maith leis.

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Lúcas
Member
Username: Lúcas

Post Number: 30
Registered: 01-2004


Posted on Wednesday, October 27, 2004 - 03:37 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Níl a bhuíochas ort, a Aonghuis. Ní raibh a fhios agam an riail sin roimh an ceist Cheltoide. Mar a deirtear, is namhaid an cheard gan a foghlaim.

Mise le meas,

Lúcas

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 346
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, October 28, 2004 - 05:58 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Is iontach Celtoid agus an Cadhnach chun mion phointí a leiriú!



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