mainoff.gif
lastdyoff.gif
lastwkoff.gif
treeoff.gif
searchoff.gif
helpoff.gif
contactoff.gif
creditsoff.gif
homeoff.gif


The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2004 (October-December) » Archive through October 30, 2004 » Prince Charles hails 'miracle' survival of Scots Gaelic « Previous Next »

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Diarmo
Member
Username: Diarmo

Post Number: 46
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 10:26 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Prince hails 'miracle' survival of Gaelic
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/scotland.cfm?id=1134332004
JOHN ROSS. The Scotsman. 28th Sept. 2004.

THE Prince of Wales backed efforts to develop Gaelic yesterday after
declaring that it was a "miracle" the language had survived.

During a visit to Sabhal Mor Ostaig, the Gaelic college on Skye,
Prince
Charles told staff and students the work of the college was vital to
people
across the globe learning about minority languages.

He said: "If Gaelic dies in Scotland, it dies in the world. If it
flourishes
here, it sends out a message of inspiration and optimism."

After touring the college, the prince, dressed in a kilt in Lord of
the
Isles tartan, said: "The great thing about it is that it provides an
opportunity to recognise that this college is a centre of excellence
and a
symbol of what can be achieved by people who care enough to turn
dreams into
reality.

"Scotland faces many challenges as well as great opportunities. And
Scottish
life is greatly enriched by the Gaelic dimension. The miracle is that
Gaelic
has survived at all. This college is a powerful statement of what
Gaelic can
achieve."

The prince met pupils from the local primary school at Sleat and was
then
taken on a tour of the Arainn Chaluim Chille (the Saint Columba
Campus) by
Norman Gillies, the college's director.

Mr Gillies said later: "We were delighted to welcome Prince Charles
on this,
his second visit as college patron. It was an extremely positive
visit and
we were greatly encouraged by His Royal Highness' statement which
highlighted the work of the college and the importance of the Gaelic
language to Scotland as a whole."

The campus, which opened in 1999, is next to the original college
site,
which has provided short courses in Gaelic music and language since
the
1970s. The prince last visited 11 years ago.

The college, which has 110 full-time students this year, is one of the
partners in the UHI Millennium Institute, the body that hopes to
create a
university of the Highlands and Islands by 2007.

It offers three degree-level courses as well as beginner classes for
those
with an interest in the Gaelic language.

Prince Charles' visit came ahead of the second draft of the long-
awaited
Gaelic Language Bill which will be unveiled today.

The Bill, expected to be on the statute books next year, will promote
the
use of Gaelic across Scotland. A national plan for the development of
the
language will be produced by 2006.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Poblachtach
Member
Username: Poblachtach

Post Number: 17
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:56 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Yes , despite all the best efforts of his ancestors and his ilk gaelic is still around.
The mans a hypocrite and an utter bawbag .

Rant over , go raibh maith agat :)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 10
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 07:14 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde,
For the benefit of anyone who might have missed it due to (sensibly?) avoiding the discussion on state support for the Irish language, I'll post again here information relevant to the Scotsman article which Diarmo has posted above.
The Scottish Executive recently established a non-departmental public body, Bòrd na Gàidhlig (http://www.bord-na-gaidhlig.org.uk/) which will be responsible for the overall direction and management of the National Plan for Gaelic in Scotland, and yesterday (27 September) introduced a Gaelic Language Bill in the Scottish Parliament (http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/business/bills/pdfs/b25s2.pdf).
Is mise le meas,
Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas
Member
Username: Jonas

Post Number: 462
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 08:51 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Yes , despite all the best efforts of his ancestors and his ilk gaelic is still around.
The mans a hypocrite and an utter bawbag


Give us a break. I'm certainly not pro-monarchy but
1. It's a well known fact that prince Charles is a supporter of Scottish Gaelic. He has been so for years and featured in many Gaelic circumstances.
2. You cannot blame anyone for what their ancestors did, no-one is responsible for what any of there ancestors did. Having said that, of course I agree that the English regents played an instrumental part in the efforts to stamp out the Celtic languages. The Tudors were the worst by far, despite being Welsh themselves - closely followed by the Scottish Stuarts...

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Diarmo
Member
Username: Diarmo

Post Number: 48
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 09:34 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Have any royals ever spoken Scots Gaelic or Welsh in the last 400 years?

Knowing that King Billy was a native speaker of Dutch!!

Does Charles know any Gaelic? and how is his Welsh?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 11
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 09:45 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Jhonais, a chara,
I agree in principle with what you say, but I'd certainly take issue with your point about the Tudors and Stuarts with specific reference to Scots Gaelic.
The Tudors were never the Royal House of Scotland, although there was some inter-marriage, with perhaps most notable being Lord Henry Darnley, husband of Mary Queen of Scots and father of James VI&I being a Tudor.
What I know of Stuart Scotland does not lead me to believe that the Royal House were particular contributors to the decline of Scots Gaelic in the period of their hegemony.
I do not think there can be any question, however, that the Royal House under which Scots Gaelic suffered most was the House of Hanover.
The post-Culloden period in particular is recognised as being the most significant in the decline of Scots Gaelic.
There is also no doubt that members of the Royal House themselves - the Duke of Cumberland in particular - were to the fore in this period of linguistic and cultural repression.
Le meas,
Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 221
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 09:52 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Chris, a chara.

De réir gnás na gaeilge, ní chuirtear an tuiseal gairmeach i bhfeidhm ar ainmneacha nach ainmneacha gaelacha, nó ainmneach gaelaithe, iad.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 13
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 09:59 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Aonghuis, a chara,
Tá mé buíoch díot as do chúnamh.

Jonas, a chara,
Gabhaim pardún agat as an teachtaireacht sin.

Beir bua agus beannacht,
Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 14
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 11:04 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A Dhairmo, a chara,
I don't know of any Royals having spoken Scots Gaelic in the last 400 years.
There is a tradition that all Princes of Wales learn Welsh, and use Welsh during their investiture ceremony at the age of 21.
I know that Charles did that. I vaguely remember seeing some of it on the TV news when I was a kid at primary school.
As for the extent of the Welsh or the quality of it... níl a fhois agam!
Slán beo!
Chris

Aguisín - I've spoken to a couple of colleagues at Sàbhal Mòr Ostaig since Charlie's visit and according to them while he was there he made no attempt to speak any Gaelic nor gave any indication of an interest or intent to learn... for all his admiration for the culture!

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 223
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 11:14 am:   Edit Post Print Post

But he did learn some Gaelic by rote for a recording of a story he wrote some time ago. At least according to a radio interview with a teacher at Sàbhal Mòr Ostaig.

But then, the language of his ancestors German, so perhaps we oughtn't expect too much from him....

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James
Member
Username: James

Post Number: 37
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 01:04 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A bit off topic, but worth mentioning I think:

If I remember things correctly, there was a daughter of Brian Boru who married into the ruling family of Scotland. Through that marriage the ancestral lineage of the Royal family can, in a rather convoluted fashion, be traced to the last ruler of a "unified" Ireland.

I might be mixing fiction with fact here. I've read most of Morgan Llewelyn's "fact bases fiction" as well as several more academic books on Irish history that involve this period. It would not be too difficult for my aging brain to have confused and intertwined these resources!

Le meas,

James

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas
Member
Username: Jonas

Post Number: 463
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 03:09 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Have any royals ever spoken Scots Gaelic or Welsh in the last 400 years?

I don't know, but it would certainly surprise me quite a lot. I know one English regent at one time tried to learn Irish but it was not during the last 100 years or so.

Does Charles know any Gaelic? and how is his Welsh?

I cannot say. I think I heard that he knows the basics of both but isn't conversant in either of them.

The Tudors were never the Royal House of Scotland

Quite right, but I never said they were Scottish. I wrote Welsh.

What I know of Stuart Scotland does not lead me to believe that the Royal House were particular contributors to the decline of Scots Gaelic in the period of their hegemony.

I fully agree, but they contributed strongly to the present fate of Ireland and the Irish language.

I do not think there can be any question, however, that the Royal House under which Scots Gaelic suffered most was the House of Hanover.

I fully agree. The decline of Scottish Gaelic started later than that of Irish and Welsh but was more rapid once it got under way - just as with Breton. The battle of Culloden certainly marked the beginning of this decline.

But then, the language of his ancestors German, so perhaps we oughtn't expect too much from him

What!?! I might be missing a point here. Would German speakers be less able to learn another languages. My experience is the opposite, the Germans are by far superior to speakers of French and English when it comes learning other languages. I know quite a number of fluent Irish speakers who are Germans.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 227
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 04:44 am:   Edit Post Print Post

No. I was being facetious. I was pointing out the language of Charles' ancestors was German rather than Scots Gaelic, and so he would be more likely to learn German than Scots Gaelic.

But that was just the irish nationalist in me taking a swipe at the "British" royal family.

I too know several Germans who are fluent, including one Quaker who lives in Derry, and makes his living teaching puppeteering to Gaelscoil pupils all over Ireland.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 18
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 04:51 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Aonghuis, a chara,
I saw you friend being interviewed in Irish on SRL on BBCNI earlier this year and his Irish seemed really excellent.
I don't know if you saw it, but I do know that they have some material from the series available on the BBCNI website, although I'm not sure if that sectoin is there - and I don't have time to check now - tá mé ag obair anois!
Slán beo!
Chris

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas
Member
Username: Jonas

Post Number: 466
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 05:09 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ah, I see. Sorry for my misunderstanding. I very much understand your taking a swipe at the royal family. By the way (and of course off-topic) is there any royal family actually being of the same nationality as their subjects?? The Swedish royal family is as Swedish as Bertie Ahern; their ancestors were French and they have been marrying Germans and English princesses all the time.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Poblachtach
Member
Username: Poblachtach

Post Number: 18
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 06:22 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Charles father, Philip is of Greek origin .

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Diarmo
Member
Username: Diarmo

Post Number: 49
Registered: 08-2004


Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 06:51 am:   Edit Post Print Post

An bhfuil Greigis aige?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 229
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 07:28 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I think it is inaccurate to say Prince Phillip is Greek: his father was titular Prince of Greece, but...they fled before he was two years old.
http://www.britainexpress.com/royals/philip.htm

The fact is the Royal families of Europe (all of them) and the high aristocracy form pretty much a nation of their own.

Recall that duing World War I, the Heads of State of Russia, the United Kingdom and Germany were cousins...

And the poor unfortunates lead fairly miserable and unfree lives.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

(Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 12.75.255.116
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 10:21 am:   Edit Post Print Post

But his ancestry is still Greek. A change of residence doesn't change your ethnicity. Just check out the sidewalks of New York.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 234
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 11:05 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ah, but if you had followed the links I placed you would find that
"His father, Prince Andrew, was the grandson of King Christian IX of Denmark, while his mother, Princess Alice of Battenberg, was the eldest child of Prince Louis of Battenberg, and sister to Earl Mountbatten of Burma."

See http://www.greekroyalfamily.org/english/family.html

"King George I, the second son of King Christian IX of Denmark, born in Copenhagen on Christmas Eve 1845, was invited to become King of the Hellenes in 1863"

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

(Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 128.119.105.206
Posted on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 10:15 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I would like to point out that the current U.S. president is also a cousin of the European Royal families, specifically a 13th cousin of Queen Elizabeth II. Some things never really change.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Tomás (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 198.22.236.230
Posted on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 08:20 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Being that geneticists recently have pointed out that the most distant relationship between any two human beings is likely no more than 32nd or 64th cousins, 13th doesn't really count for much now does it "Unregistered"? You might be Elizabeth's 12th cousin, for all you know, but it still hasn't bought you an invite to dinner at Buckingham now has it?



©Daltaí na Gaeilge