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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2004 (July-September) » Archive through September 27, 2004 » Eire « Previous Next »

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michelle (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 212.85.1.1
Posted on Saturday, September 11, 2004 - 06:26 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ireland is the anglicised form of Eirland. Do you think the government is considering changing the country name internationally. The official name is Eire but no one knows it. (needs to get approval from the UN, I think...) I really prefer the name Eire!

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 97
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 11, 2004 - 10:12 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ireland came from

Éire

plus "-land" which is some sort of German suffix.

No, the government is most certainly not changing the country name internationally. A country can't do that! Germany's name is "Deutschland", but we call it Germany. The Spanish call us "Irlando". Spain's name is "España" I believe, but we call them Spain! We call China "An tSín".

Éire is the name of this country in the Irish language.
Ireland is the name of this country in the English language.
Irland is the name of this country in the German language.
Irlando is the name of this country in the Spanish language.

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Michelle (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 212.85.1.1
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 05:11 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I know but there are quite a few countries that changed their country name -- like Zaire (now called Congo) and Burma (it's not authorised by UN but now internationally known as Myanmar)

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 136
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 05:19 am:   Edit Post Print Post

But the word "Eirland" does not exist in any language known. Even the Ulster Scots call it Airlann. (see http://www.waterwaysireland.org/ for example).

Bunreacht na hÉireann
Article 4

The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.

Airteagal 4

Éire is ainm don Stát nó, sa Sacs-Bhéarla, Ireland

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MIchelle (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 212.85.1.1
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 06:00 am:   Edit Post Print Post

The name "Myanmar" is their own local language, unlike Burma. So it is possible that the world can call Eire!!

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 137
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 06:28 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Actually, the British media usually do (or used to) refer to the State as Éire. But that is part of their pretence (POLITICS WARNING) that the rest of the country shouldn't be part of the State.

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 106
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 13, 2004 - 06:38 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I find that they use "Éire" because it takes up less space on the screen. eg.

To vote for X to win Big Brother:

UK: 15550516546468468
ÉIRE: 6546544643465464

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Liam Ó Briain (Unregistered Guest)
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Posted From: 194.125.167.117
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 09:57 am:   Edit Post Print Post

The British in particular(and some Aussies) use Éire rather than the english version which they should be using Republic of Ireland because we have our independence which irritates them greatly so they don't acknowledge that. I've met many fine British people who incredibly don't realise not all Ireland is in the U.K. Put it this way Wales is not refered to as Cymru on British stations. We don't refer to Spain as Espana.

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 130
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 10:22 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Let those aformentioned British think what they like - just 'cause they don't acknowledge our independence doesn't mean squat. Their money looks shit too.

BTW, out of curiosity, is "Britain" or "The UK" under one government type thingie? Like for example if some-one commits a crime in California, they can be arrested in Arizona. If some-one commits a crime in England and then legs it to Wales, do the Welsh police co-operate with the English police under the banner of "Britain", like with CA and AZ under "USA"?

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Caoimhín
Board Administrator
Username: Caoimhín

Post Number: 86
Registered: 01-1999


Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 11:11 am:   Edit Post Print Post

This conversation is drifting into off-topic political discussion.

Please use care to keep it related to the Irish language.

Caoimhín

Tír gan teanga, tír gan anam.

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Cait
Member
Username: Cait

Post Number: 2
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 11:30 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Just curious, what does "Fear na mBróg" mean?
I know "fear" means "man", but i don't remember "bróg"...

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Dáithí
Member
Username: Dáithí

Post Number: 13
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 12:07 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A chara a Cait,

Brog means shoe, but I'm sure Fear na mBrog can give you a complete derivation of the word shoe and his name.

Dáithí

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James
Member
Username: James

Post Number: 24
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 12:24 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Actually, the Spanish call Ireland "Irlandesa"

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 131
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Saturday, September 18, 2004 - 01:48 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A Cháit,

Been asked this question before...

fear = man

Nominative
----------
singular = fear
plural = fir

Posessive
---------
singular = fir
plural = fear


bróg = shoe

Nominative
----------
singular = bróg
plural = bróga

Posessive
---------
singular = bróige
plural = bróg

Fear na mBróg = The Shoe Man (from The Shoes' Man)


Get a dictionary! Then if you want to get all the different cases of the word, singular and plural, go to http://csis.ul.ie/focloir and type it in.

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Poblachtach
Member
Username: Poblachtach

Post Number: 12
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2004 - 10:13 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

James , Ireland in Spanish is Irlanda

Irlandesa is 'Irish woman ( or girl )' or also if the noun is feminie ie

F. leche irlandesa Irish milk
M . queso irlandes Irish cheese

conversely irlandes is Irishman

cheers

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James
Member
Username: James

Post Number: 25
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 - 08:12 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A Phoblachtach,

Your are absolutely right. I stand corrected.

I just knew Irlando was wrong and it's been so long since I've HAD to speak Spanish on a daily basis....well, I guess you could say I'm a bit rusty.

Thanks for the correction.

Le meas,

James

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 150
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 - 09:24 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Castellano es mas facil que Irlandes, pero no tan facil!

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Jonas
Member
Username: Jonas

Post Number: 434
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 - 10:03 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Si, Aonghus - castellano es más fácil pero irlandés es más agradable ;-)

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Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 1
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 - 10:20 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde,
Mar eolas daoibh:
El castellano es más fácil que el irlandés, pero eso no quiere decir que es muy fácil.
Would be a grammatical way of saying what I think you mean, Aonghus - you need articles in a sentence like that en castellano, and using "tan" immediately after a comparison like that doesn't work.
To get back to the original idea of this thread, though:
Éire is the island of Ireland. F na mB rightly points out that the Irish Constitution defines this as the name of the State, with Ireland being the name in the English language.
Administratively, however, the island is currently divided into "Poblacht na hÉireann" nó "an Phoblacht na hÉireann"(The Republic of Ireland) and "Tuaisceart Éireann" nó "an Tuaisceart na hÉireann" (Northern Ireland).
Many Republicans eschew the use of these two terms for the administrative divisions - I'll avoid the politics of why that is so, and stick to the purely linguistic fact that they will often refer to them by the number of counties in each. "Na sé gcontae is fiche" nó "na sé is fiche contae" (the twenty-six counties) for "Poblacht na hÉireann", and "na sé gcontae" (the six counties) for "Tuaisceart na hÉireann.
The term Éire, again as rightly described by F n mB, is often used as a space saving device in printed matter. Unfortunately, it is also often used wrongly by certain sectors of the British media, to denote the twenty-six counties in situations in which they wish to emphasise the seperateness of the other six.
I hope this is useful.
Slán beo!
Chris

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 152
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, September 20, 2004 - 11:24 am:   Edit Post Print Post

ACHT PHOBLACHT NA hÉIREANN, 1948.

Alt 2 Dearbhaítear leis seo gur Poblacht na hÉireann is gnéthuairisc ar an Stát.

It is hereby declared that the description of the State shall be the Republic of Ireland.

Irish does not require two definitive articles.

However, to get back to the original question - There is no such place as Eirland, and it is likely that the island will be referred to a Ireland in the English language while that language exists.

(Message edited by aonghus on September 20, 2004)

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Pádraig
Member
Username: Pádraig

Post Number: 20
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 12:50 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Seems to me I've seen Éire in print without the fada. I couldn't swear to it, but I think it was on a postage stamp.
A heavy load?

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 153
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 04:04 am:   Edit Post Print Post

An Post has been known to err. Usually, when this happen computer get blamed!

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 154
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 04:07 am:   Edit Post Print Post

By the way, there is a subtle semantic difference between
Tuaisceart Éireann
and
Tuaisceart na hÉireann

The former refers to that part of the United Kingdom which is on this Island, the latter to the North of this Island, which includes Donegal - which some people, ignoring the compass, refer to as being in the "South"

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Pádraig
Member
Username: Pádraig

Post Number: 21
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 11:16 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I grew up thinking that Dún na nGall was in the south because it was part of the Republic. When I finally got around to looking carefully at the map, I was surprised to discover how very far north it lies. I guess that accounts for the Ulster influence in the speech.

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Pádraig
Member
Username: Pádraig

Post Number: 22
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Tuesday, September 21, 2004 - 11:22 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

And as for tuaisceart vs. tuaisceart na ... I never would have thought of the latter, and I'm not sure I understand the distinction. Is it the difference between North and Northern?

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Aonghus
Member
Username: Aonghus

Post Number: 163
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 04:34 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Pádraig - it is usage. "Tuaisceart Éireann" is used for that part of the UK, based on the english usage Northern Ireland.

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 147
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 05:15 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ulster = Ulaidh:

Donegal = Dún na nGall
Derry = Doire
Antrim = Aontroim
Down = An Dún
Tyrone = Tír Eoghain
Fermanagh = Fear Manach
(The above 6 are in both in Britain and Ulster)
(The below 2 are in Ulster, but are not in Britain)
Cavan = An Cabhán
Monaghan = Muineachán

Leinster = Laighin:

Dublin = Baile Átha Cliath
Kildare = Cill Dara
Meath = An Mhí
Westmeath = An Iarmhí
Wicklow = Cill Mhantáin
Longford = An Longfort
Kilkenny = Cill Chainnigh
Wexford = Loch Garman
Laois = Laois
Carlow = Ceatharlach
Offaly = Uíbh Fhaillí
Louth = Lú

Munster = An Mhumhain:

Cork = Corcaigh
Kerry = Ciarraí
Limerick = Luimneach
Clare = An Clár
Tipperary = Tiobraid Árainn
Waterford = Port Láirge

Connacht = Connachta:

Galway = Gaillimh
Mayo = Maigh Eo
Leitrim = Liatroim
Sligo = Sligeach
Roscommon = Ros Comáin

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Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 2
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 05:45 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde,
Na sé gcontae:

Aontroim (Antrim)
Ard mhacha (Armagh)
Doire (Derry)
An Dún (Down)
Fear Manach (Fermanagh)
Tír Eoghain (Tyrone)

These counties aren't in Britain (the large island on the other side of the Irish Sea) but in Ireland. They are, however, currently administratively part of the UK.

An Cabhán (Cavan)
Dún na nGall nó Tír Chonaill (Donegal)
Muineachán (Monaghan)

Are the other three counties of the historic "kingdom" of Ulster (Uladh), currently under Dublin adminsitration.
Le meas,
Chris

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Ó_diocháin
Member
Username: Ó_diocháin

Post Number: 3
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 05:55 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde,
Na sé gcontae:

Aontroim (Antrim)
Ard mhacha (Armagh)
Doire (Derry)
An Dún (Down)
Fear Manach (Fermanagh)
Tír Eoghain (Tyrone)

These counties aren't in Britain (the large island on the other side of the Irish Sea) but in Ireland. They are, however, currently administratively part of the UK.

An Cabhán (Cavan)
Dún na nGall nó Tír Chonaill (Donegal)
Muineachán (Monaghan)

Are the other three counties of the historic "kingdom" of Ulster (Uladh), currently under Dublin adminsitration.
Le meas,
Chris

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Fear_na_mbróg
Member
Username: Fear_na_mbróg

Post Number: 148
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, September 22, 2004 - 07:14 am:   Edit Post Print Post

31 counties, I knew I should've counted them! I left out Ard Mhacha.
Also, I incorrectly stated that Donegal was a part of the UK.

Here they are again, double-checked this time:

Ulster = Ulaidh:

Armgah = Ard Mhacha
Derry = Doire
Antrim = Aontroim
Down = An Dún
Tyrone = Tír Eoghain
Fermanagh = Fear Manach
(The above 6 are in both the UK and Ulster)
(The below 3 are in Ulster, but are not in the UK)
Cavan = An Cabhán
Monaghan = Muineachán
Donegal = Dún na nGall / Tír Chonaill

Leinster = Laighin:

Dublin = Baile Átha Cliath
Kildare = Cill Dara
Meath = An Mhí
Westmeath = An Iarmhí
Wicklow = Cill Mhantáin
Longford = An Longfort
Kilkenny = Cill Chainnigh
Wexford = Loch Garman
Laois = Laois
Carlow = Ceatharlach
Offaly = Uíbh Fhaillí
Louth = Lú

Munster = An Mhumhain:

Cork = Corcaigh
Kerry = Ciarraí
Limerick = Luimneach
Clare = An Clár
Tipperary = Tiobraid Árainn
Waterford = Port Láirge

Connacht = Connachta:

Galway = Gaillimh
Mayo = Maigh Eo
Leitrim = Liatroim
Sligo = Sligeach
Roscommon = Ros Comáin



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