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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2004 (July-September) » Archive through July 15, 2004 » Tuilleadh fadhbanna « Previous Next »

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Celtoid (205.188.116.207 - 205.188.116.207)
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 07:27 am:   Edit Post Print Post

An bhfuil duine ar bith in ann an abairt seo a mhínú dhom? "D'fhág sin cúram an bhaile fré chéile ar Cholm arís, arae ba ghearr uirthi féin a raibh Bríd a shaothrú agus, ar aon chor, phós sí ar a bheith bliain curtha do Phádraig."

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Fear na mBróg (213.94.240.145 - 213.94.240.145)
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 07:56 am:   Edit Post Print Post


Quote:

"D'fhág sin cúram an bhaile fré chéile ar Cholm arís, arae ba ghearr uirthi féin a raibh Bríd a shaothrú agus, ar aon chor, phós sí ar a bheith bliain curtha do Phádraig."




fré? Should that be "fé"?

That left the upkeep of the house to Colm again, however it wasn't long before Bríd was earning again, and in anyway, she married Pádraig having been with him a year.

Something like that.

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 09:06 am:   Edit Post Print Post

fré is Conamara dialect for trí

D'fhág sin cúram an bhaile fré chéile ar Cholm arís - that left all the cares of home to Colm

arae ba ghearr uirthi féin a raibh Bríd a shaothrú- since Bríd was barely earning her own keep

agus, ar aon chor, phós sí ar a bheith bliain curtha do Phádraig. - and anyway, she married once Pádraig had been buried a year

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Celtoid (64.12.116.136 - 64.12.116.136)
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 07:37 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I knew the first part. I was close on the second part. The third part, I didn't have a clue. She married on being a year buried for Pádraig.? Huh? Why wouldn't he write, "...ar a bheith bliain a bhí Pádraig curtha.", or "...ar a bheith bliain ó bhí Pádraig curtha."?

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Tuesday, July 13, 2004 - 04:39 am:   Edit Post Print Post

You'll have to ask Mairtín that in the next life.

However, your first alternative is incorrect.

The second is the difference between "P was buried a year ago" and his version "P has been buried a year".

As you see, there are both alternatives in English.

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Tomás (198.22.236.230 - 198.22.236.230)
Posted on Wednesday, July 14, 2004 - 10:46 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Ar dtús, a Cheltoid, caithfidh mé a rá "maith thú!" Taking on "Cré na Cille"!??

I learn something new here every day. Some days, two things. I learned that 'fré' is Conamara dialect for 'trí', which I guess I knew once but had completely forgotten. And, my curiosity piqued, I learned the following:

'ar' + verbal nominative (infinitive) + 'do' -- is one of those phrases that have to be taken as a whole, that defy deconstructive analysis in translation (at least mine). They just are the way they are, and that this particular phrase's tense is totally contextual. Basically, it means "when (someone) does/did 'x'" Mar shampla,

"ar a dhéanamh dom é" = when I do/did it.

"ar éirí di" = when she rises/rose.

So, "...ar a bheith bliain curtha do Phádraig." = ...when Pádraig is/was a year buried. Of course, you know it's "was" because of the context.

Tomás

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Maidhc Ó G. (65.128.204.122 - 65.128.204.122)
Posted on Wednesday, July 14, 2004 - 11:51 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I love these constructions as they always feel so poetic.
"... ar a bheith blian curtha do Phádraig."
? ... on his being a year buried for him Pádraig.
"...ar éirí di" - on rising for her. (on her rising).
I wish I could find a book containing these idiomatic constructions. Preposition + verbal noun + predicate.
Does this ring a bell to anyone?
-Maidhc.

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Tomás (198.22.236.230 - 198.22.236.230)
Posted on Wednesday, July 14, 2004 - 04:07 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

'Sea, sin é go díreach, a Mhaidhc. The syntax and idiom of English and Irish are so different, sometimes that a literal English translation of some Irish idioms renders the phrase practically incomprehensible to the English speaker. BUT! To impose the English idiom on the Irish results in a loss of the poetic beauty of the language. And, Maidhc, I completely agree that a collection of idiomatic usages and sayings collected from all dialects would be great. That and a collection of usable curses.

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Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 05:03 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Usables curses (and blessings) can be obtained. 500 of each, at 5 Euros. (1 cent a curse or blessing)

Look for "500 Beannacht" and "500 Mallacht ort" from Breandán Mac Gearailt.

I don't know about the idioms; I know there are some books of phrases available. Look at www.cuplafocal.ie I can't remember the title of any of these books offhand.

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Maidhc Ó G. (65.128.200.203 - 65.128.200.203)
Posted on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:09 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Go raibh maith agaibh, a chairde.

-Maidhc.



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