mainoff.gif
lastdyoff.gif
lastwkoff.gif
treeoff.gif
searchoff.gif
helpoff.gif
contactoff.gif
creditsoff.gif
homeoff.gif


The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2003 (October-December) » Advice « Previous Next »

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Tim OMahoney (67.67.9.163 - 67.67.9.163)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 12:45 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I'm trying to learn irish on my own, but the book I have said that it gives priority to Ulster dialect. How do I know which dialect is best and do they have many similarities?? Will I be able to get a good general knowledge of the language from this book? I eventually want to learn to write the language as well. Any good advice on getting started the right way?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James (199.112.55.122 - 199.112.55.122)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 01:14 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Tim, A Chara:

The Ulster Dialect is one that I'm not terribly familiar with but I have seen and heard it. There is even a site on the net where you can get some lessons in that dialect but I can't remember it off the top of my head. Go to the search option in the margin to the left and enter Ulster Dialect. You should be able to find that link. It may be helpful to you.

For the most part, Irish from Dingle can be understood by the Irish speakers of Antrim and vice versa. The biggest differences I've noticed are in pronunciation (I personally think Ulster is a harsher sound...that's just me, though) and in vocabulary. Cád é mar atá tú in Ulster is Cónas tá tú in Munster and Cén choai bhfuil tú in Conamara. (Some of those fadas might be out of place...sorry) All of them mean "How are you?" but as you can see there are a number of ways to ask that question!

As for which dialect to learn....that's completely up to you. I think you'll find that most on this site are LEARNING Cois Fhairrage (Conemara) Irish. This probably has more to do with the thoroughness of the text, Learning Irish by Michéal ÓSíadhal. There are a number of native speakers here as well but to be honest, I don't know what dialects they speak. They seem to be able to answer questions from just about any corner, though so you're in good hands.

There are others learning the Munster dialect from the Teach Yourself Irish series. Either way, we're all in this together and most basic questions and confusions are not dialectal at all. They tend to be issues of grammar and pronunciation. The latter being the only area where you'll encounter significant differences between the dialects.

Whatever you decide, Fáilte! (Welcome!) You've found the best site on the net for your studies!

Le meas,

James

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.178.183 - 213.243.178.183)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 04:16 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde!

It is a common view that the Irish in Ó Sé's Teach Yourself Irish is Munster Irish. Common as it is, it is absolutely wrong. The Irish in that book is standard Irish, a mix of all dialects. To someone from Connacht it might well appear to be Munster Irish, but to us who speak Munster Irish it is the Connacht features that stand out. I could list a hundred (no exaggeration) differences between Munster Irish and the Irish of TYI, but I guess such a list would be rather boring ;-)

Then to Tim's question, which dialect is "the best":

That’s an easy question, it's the West Kerry dialect. ;-)
Why?
1. It is the most beautiful Irish dialect.
2. It is spoken in the most beautiful part of Ireland
3. Its speakers are extremly nice
4. The best irish books are written in this dialect.

Quite easy, don’t you think ;-)

Seriously, it is a very hard question to answer, and no short simple answers exits. Which dialect you should learn dependens solely on your own preferences, but I’ll try to give a brief introduction.

You may know that there are three main dialects of Irish: Ulster in Co. Donegal; Connacht in Co. Galway and Co. Mayo; Munster in Co. Kerry, Co. Cork and Co. Waterford.
All these three main dialects (with a number of subdialects) are spoken as the first, and sometimes the only, language in communities along the western seabord.

1. Ulster. This dialect is the main language northwestern Ireland, the most important villages include Gaoth Dobhair, Bun Beag, Gort a’ Choirce, and Rinn na Féiste as well as Tory Island.
It is also spoken somewhat further south in places like Gleann Cholm Cille, Teileann and Baile na Finne, but English is the first language is these villages.
The Ulster dialect is quite different from other Irish dialects, some even claim that it is closer to Scottish Gaelic. (Then there are those who claim that Scottish Gaelic is a dialect of Irish...) Admittingly, the dialect shares many features in grammar, vocabulary and pronounciation with Scottish Gaelic, which makes it a bit hard for speakers of other dialects to understand the speakers of this dialect. The differences aren’t, however, be insurmountable, but it takes some practising before a speaker (or learner) of other dialects can converse with the speakers.

2. Connacht. This is the largest dialect, and is the main language along the northern coast of Galway Bay in an area stretching from An Spidéal to Carna. Villages in this entirely Irish-speaking area include Indreabhán, An Cheathrú Rua, Tír an Fhia (where I’ve lived), Ros Muc and Cill Chiaráin; it is also the first language of the Aran Islands. A subdialect is spoken in some villages in Co. Mayo, i.e. Tuar Mhic Eadaigh and Ceathrú Thaidhg, but English has almost replaced the Irish of Mayo.
The Connacht dialect is in many aspects halfway between Ulster and Munster. This is, without doubt, the least archaic dialect: it is strikingly modern and simplified.

3. Munster. This dialect is the first language of the western part of the Dingle Peninsula (the westermost part of Europe), including villages such as Dún Chaoin, Baile an Fheirtéaraigh (where I’ve also lived and learned my Irish), Baile na nGall, Muiríoch and An Feothanach. It is also the first language of Cuil Aodha in the Cork Mountains.
The dialect is also spoken in the easten part of Dingle peninsula, in the Uíbh Ráthach peninsula, on Cléire Island and along the river Lee (Laoi) in villages such as Béal Átha an Gaorthaidh, but English dominates in these areas. A subdialect is spoken in An Rinn in Co. Waterford, and is quite strong.
The Munster is in many ways the most archaic dialect (the oldest living Celtic speech, if you want). Because of this its conjugations are a little bit more complicated than the other, but at the same time it adds a certain charm.

Now, which dialect is easiest to learn?
1. Ulster. The pronounciation may present some problems when learing this dialect, but apart from that it sould be quite easy to learn, and once learned it should be easy to converse with other speakers of the same dialect. (as well as speakers of other dialects with a little effort)

2. Connacht. This dialect has one huge advantage for learners, the best book for beginners is written in it: Learning Irish by Mícheál Ó Siadhail. On the whole, it is quite easy to learn this dialect with it’s simplified grammar BUT unlike the other dialects, you might have problems conversing with its speakers even once you’ve learned it. The reason is that in normal speech most endings are reduced to a simpel schwa-sound (like e in english the, french le). In addtion, many other sounds are frequently dropped. This gives the dialect a sound like where it spoken deep down in the throat. Actually, it IS spoken deep down the throat. Because of this, native speakers of this dialect can be tricky to understand for beginners. When I first came to Connemara I spoke Irish, but I still had trouble the first weeks.

3. Munster. As said, the conjugations make this dialects slightly harder, but they can easily be mastered in a day or two (they are perfectly regular). The advantage with this dialect is that its speakers normally are well-articulated and don’t speak as fast as in some other dialects. This contributes to making the speakers of this dialect the easiest to converse with for a learner.

Then about the beauty. I can, of course, only speak for myself here.
1. Ulster. When asked the question “which dialect is the most beautiful” many native speakers will answer Ulster, regardless of which dialect they speak themselves. Part of the reason is that is sounds somewhat exotic to other Irish speakers, but I guess that most English speakers think that all dialects sound exotic.

2. Connacht. To the mentioned question “which dialect is the most beautiful” hardly any speakers will answer Connacht. The deep-throat sounds combined with reductions do have their charm, but they are not commonly appreciated. Another reason may be that Ulster and Munster speakers reject the simplification of the grammar.

3. Munster. Once again, many Irish speakers, regardless of their own dialect, think this is the most beautiful. The archaic forms and stress-pattern do have a certain appeal, it certainly gives it a more musical sound.

Well, there's some information of the dialects from my personal point of view.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Dennis Leyden (152.13.196.199 - 152.13.196.199)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 09:23 am:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde,

I don't know if this is what you were referring to, but I have found Ulster dialect lessons on the BBC-Northern Ireland website. Just go to their Irish language service site (http://www.bbc.co.uk/northernireland/blas/index.shtml) and click on Learners Courses to be connected to "Giota Beag" ("A Little Bit"). I'm only a duffer, but I must confess that although I have an emotional desire to learn the Connacht dialect, I prefer the Ulster dialect because it sounds a bit crisper, and more like it's spelled. (For example, "mhaith" sounds like a swallowed English "why" rather than "wah".) Plus, I find the lessons to have a fresh, contemporary feel to them.

Dennis

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James (199.112.55.122 - 199.112.55.122)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 10:46 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Dennis, A Chara.

That's the one. I remembered it from a few months back but couldn't remember the site. Maith thú!

Le meas,

James

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.190.42 - 213.243.190.42)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 12:48 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Dennis, a chara

Thanks for adding the link, I think it is one of the best on-line resources for Irish.
May I disagree with your view that Ulster Irish sounds more like it's spelled?
When you talk of "the Connacht dialect" I guess you mean the dialect of Conamara. That dialect is indeed quite special, but it would be wrong to think of it as THE Connacht dialect. When Irish was spoken throughout Connacht (less that 100 years ago) the dialect of Connacht was indeed so homogenous that it makes sense to talk of a Connacht dialect instead of dialects. The only area in Connacht that significantly differed from the general Connacht dialect was, you guessed it, Conamara. ;-)

This is still the situation today, although Irish is dead in most of Connacht. (For shame...)
However, the typical Connacht dialect is still spoken in Co. Mayo, both in the area around Tuar Mhic Éadaigh and in Iorras. These Gaeltachts are indeed much weaker than Conamara, but they are still alive. The Irish spoken there, the typical Connacht Irish, is generally acknowledged by both native speakers and linguists to be the closest to both Classical Irish and to the Irish spelling, much closer than both Conamara and Ulster. And yes, they do pronounce "mhaith" as English "why" in Mayo as well.

Some quotes on the subject:
"On the whole it would seem that the Irish of N. Connacht has the fewest deviations from the older pronunciation." (O'Rahilly in Irish Dialects)

"Its phonetic system is the best preserved of all the extant Irish dialects known to me, that is to say, is the most fully in conformity with the ortography of Early Modern Irish." (Mac Neill in Clare Island Survey)

"Indeed, observers have been struck by the apparent closeness of the dialect to the classical form of Modern Irish" (de Búrca in The Irish of Tourmakeady).

By the way, Mayo Irish is a beautiful dialect.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.190.42 - 213.243.190.42)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 12:56 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Mea Culpa, I have been guilty of an error. The long post above about different dialects is something I wrote some years ago. I now see that I wrote
"The Connacht dialect is in many aspects halfway between Ulster and Munster. This is, without doubt, the least archaic dialect: it is strikingly modern and simplified"

And then I go on in my next post to say the Irish of Connacht is the one dialect that is closest to classical Irish. Obviously I must be wrong in one of the posts ;-)
In the older post I made the same generalisation as Dennis, I thought of Conamara Irish as Connacht Irish. I was absolutely wrong in that, the difference between Iorras and Conamara is considerable. Conamara very modern, Iorras very close to classical Irish.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Dennis Leyden (152.13.197.183 - 152.13.197.183)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 01:38 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Go raibh maith agaibh for the information. It certainly gives me hope that I might someday learn the language that my great-grandfather would have heard/perhaps spoken (I don't know where he was from, but he was born about 140 years ago and, if the only Ellis Island ship's log I can find from the 1890s that has his name is for the ship that he came over in, he was from Galway).

Since I have sibh, I wonder if I could ask a question about the pronunciation of the future tense, and in particular the "f" in the future ending. I keep fighting the notion that this "f" is not pronounced (or is pronounced as an ever so slight "h" sound) because I don't want the future to sound like the conditional (I think it's the conditional but I'm away from by books right now, so I may have mixed it up with another tense). In the Connacht (not Conamara) pronunciation, is the "f" pronounced? Or should I accept the fact that while there are different spellings for the future and the conditional, they sound the same in practice and one simply has to know in conversation from the context which it is?

Go raibh maith agaibh arís,

Dennis

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.190.42 - 213.243.190.42)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 02:28 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

An excellent question concerning the pronunciation of "f". As far as I know, the only Gaeltacht area where you can still hear the "f" is on Clear Island in County Cork. Still, there is no risk for mixing the future and the conditional. You said that you might have thought of another tense, so I'll give all tenses. Taking the word "caill - to lose" and its pronunciation in Mayo (and the way it was in most of Connacht)

The pattern is first the English translation, then the Irish spelling and after that the Irish pronunciation

loses - caillean - kaL´in´
lost - chaill - xaL´
used to lose - chailleadh - xaL´u
will lose - caillfidh - kal´hi
would lose - chaillfeadh - xal´hu

As you see, there is no risk for mixing the future and the conditional. The begin with two totally different sounds and end with two different sounds. In English they would be something like (very roughly, English is only my fourth language so I don't trust my spelling of Irish sounds with an English ortography.)

caillfidh - cal-hee
chaillfeadh - ghal-hoo

You might have been thinking of the imperfect tense, it is really rather similar to the conditional.
chailleadh - xaL´u - ghal-oo
chaillfeadh - xaL´hu - ghal-hoo

This isn't too big a problem. The imperfect tense is not used that often and the "h"-sound is pronounced quite clearly. In Scottish Gaelic these tenses have actually merged, though. Hope this helps, I'll be glad to answer other questions if you have any.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Maidhc Ó G. (67.235.185.59 - 67.235.185.59)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 03:29 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, a chara,
You'd mentioned that the dialect of Mayo is quite beautiful. I'm studying from Ó Siadhail currently, but hope to gravitate towards this dialect. (God willing, before I turn to dust.):)
Would you know of any resourses I might look into that could help in this endeavor short of actually going there. (That would be the most obvious.)
Le ard mheas.
-Maidhc.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.190.42 - 213.243.190.42)
Posted on Tuesday, November 04, 2003 - 04:53 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A chara
This is a problem. If you want to learn Conamara Irish you take Ó Siadhail and if you want to learn Kerry/West Cork Irish you turn to Dillon. For Ulster Irish there is "Irish on your Own" and "Giota Beag" (though they won't take you as far as Ó Siadhail or Dillon.) That leaves Mayo Irish and Waterford Irish as the only two dialects without a course. Quite frustrating. Once I actually adapted the first chapters of "Learning Irish" into Mayo Irish... When I reviewed a new book on Kerry Irish I made a table of resources, it would look something like this.

1. Phonology:
a. Perfectly described
- West Cork Irish
- Cois Fhairrge Irish (Co. Galway)
- South Donegal Irish
b. Very well described
- An Rinn Irish (Co. Waterford)
- South Mayo Irish
- Northwest Mayo Irish
- Tory Island Irish (Co. Donegal
c. Well described
- Corca Dhuibhne Irish (Co. Kerry)
d. Shortly described
- Oileán Chléire Irish (Co. Cork)
- Aran Irish (Co. Galway)
- Conamara Irish (Co. Galway)
e. Not described
- Gaoth Dobhair (Co. Donegal)
- Gleann na Finne (Co. Donegal)
- Uíbh Ráthach (Co. Kerry)

2.Grammar
a. Perfectly described
- Corca Dhuibhne Irish (Co. Kerry)
- Cois Fhairrge Irish (Co. Galway)
- South Donegal Irish
b. Very well described
- Oileán Chléire Irish (Co. Cork)
- Tory Island Irish (Co. Donegal
c. Well described
- Northwest Mayo Irish
- Conamara Irish (Co. Galway)
d. Shortly described
- Gaoth Dobhair (Co. Donegal)
- Aran Irish (Co. Galway)
e. Not described
- Gleann na Finne (Co. Donegal)
- Uíbh Ráthach (Co. Kerry)
- West Cork Irish
- An Rinn Irish (Co. Waterford)
- South Mayo Irish

To this I might now add:

3.Courses
a. Perfect corses
- Cois Fhairrge Irish (Co. Galway) (Ó Siadhail)
b. Very good courses / Perfect course in almost identical dialect
- West Cork Irish (Dillon)
- Aran Irish (Co. Galway) (Ó Siadhail)
- Conamara Irish (Co. Galway) (Ó Siadhail)
c. Good course / Very good course in almost identical dialect
- Corca Dhuibhne Irish (Co. Kerry) (Dillon)
- Oileán Chléire Irish (Co. Cork) (Dillon)
- Gaoth Dobhair (Co. Donegal) (Irish on your own)
d. Good course in almost identical dialect
- Tory Island Irish (Co. Donegal) (Irish on your own)
e. No course
- Gleann na Finne (Co. Donegal)
- Uíbh Ráthach (Co. Kerry)
- South Donegal Irish
- An Rinn Irish (Co. Waterford)
- South Mayo Irish
- Northwest Mayo Irish

In other words, the phonology of Mayo Irish has been described quite well, the grammar less so. And no, there is no course.

When I first came to Ireland my nextdoor neighbour was an old native speaker from Mayo. He used to drop in almost every evening (I stayed with a family) and sit in the kitchen and talk Irish, slowly at first, to me and tell me stories from his home area. He was truly the finest story teller I ever heard. I've never been intrested in fishing, but once I and a girlfried (equally uninterested in fishing) sat spellbound for over an hour when he told us about the finer secrets of fishing. He also told a lot of the old traditions that were around when he grew up in An Fod Dubh. It is still one of the very strongholds of Mayo Irish and in his youth there were many monoglots there and no English was heard. Having such a friend and tutor makes a course unnecessary ;-)

The best thing to do, short of going to AN Fód Dubh or Ceathrú Thaidhg, is to get the book The Irish of Erris. Good on phonology, weak ob grammar. Then there are the phonetic texts from the area, they include some pages on grammar and pronunciation. I'll check the name. Apart from that there is very little to be found. If you have any specific questions I'll do my best to answer them.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Maidhc Ó G. (67.235.185.91 - 67.235.185.91)
Posted on Wednesday, November 05, 2003 - 09:09 am:   Edit Post Print Post

GRMA, Jonas, a chara,
And thanks for rubbing it in. LOL ;) I'll definitely have to look into "The Irish of Erris" (An bhuil an t-ainm an shcríbhneora nó "ISBN" agat?) and searching for those texts. If you remember the names of them, please let me know. GRMMA don chuidiú roimh ré.
-Le ard mheas,
Maidhc.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Tomás (198.22.236.230 - 198.22.236.230)
Posted on Wednesday, November 05, 2003 - 09:36 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, a chara, -- I thought I knew them all, but I'm not familiar with Dillon's course. What is the title of it. -- Tomás

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.176.60 - 213.243.176.60)
Posted on Wednesday, November 05, 2003 - 07:11 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

A chairde

I should have remembered adding the information about the books in question, serious blunder to leaver it out

The Irish of Erris, Co Mayo
Éamonn Mhac an Fhailigh
ISBN 0 901282 02 2
http://www.celt.dias.ie/publications/cat/e/e2-9.html

As for Dillon's excellent course, there is a curse on it... Sorry, couldn't resist ;-)
The problem is that it is called Teach Yourself Irish. In other words, the title is identical with Ó Sé's course. What is more, it was produced by the same publisher.

In the 1960s a great number of Teach Yourself X was published, almost all of them truly great books. The problem in these days was the sound recordings, of course, but the books themselves were excellent. I've read the Irish, Welsh, Gaelic and Serbo-Croat books, as well as looking through the Finnish, Swedish and Norwegian books. Some of them very good, some are pure genius.
Now, in the late 80s / early 90s new books were written to replace the old ones. The good thing is that these new versions all have soundrecordings. The bad thing is that they are, well, not-as-good (trying to be diplomatic).
The main problem is simply that there is much less of everything in them, except empty space. True, it looks nicer if every page isn't jammed with text in small font, I'll grant them that. The many drawings also give the books a more "easy" flair. Unfortunately this comes at the expense of content. Every single Teach Yourself Language that I've compared between the old and the new version turned out to contain much more in the old books. They were written for people at universities, the new ones are for casual tourists. In my opinion this is a bad mistake. The new Teach Yourself books are too heavy for those who only want to learn some phrases, they are better off with a phrase book. On the other hand, they are too light for the serious learners. Having said that, there are some Teach Yourself books that aren't that bad at all. The Welsh one is quite enjoyable. I wouldn't call the new Teach Yourself Irish bad, but it is a far cry from Dillon's epic (in my opinion) course.

The old TYI did not bother with any standard Irish, taking the view that the best Irish is spoken in na Gaeltachtaí. Dillon chose one dialect, that of Cúil Aodha in Co. Cork. This was no biased choice, Dillon was an expert on the Irish of the Aran Islands as well as on the Irish of Mayo. His reasons were
1. There were already an excellent phonology on the Cúil Aodha dialect - always a helpful thing for the learner.
2. Few, if any, dialect could match the amount of tales and stories collected and written down in this dialect.

Aften having explained this Dillon goes on to teach every aspect of Irish as it is spoken in Cúil Aodha. There is no feature, no phonetical or grammatical exception, no odd word that escape him. (Just like Ó Siadhail he gives the exact pronunciation of each and every word). When the learner has finished Dillon's book he will be way past the intermediate stage of speaking Irish and he will have a perfect Cúil Aodha Irish. Given that the Irish of West Cork identical (with some very few exceptions) to that of Kerry I have always recommended this course to everyone with an interest in Corca Dhuibhne Irish. In my opinion one of the best language courses ever in any language. A must for anyone wanting to speak Munster Irish.

Unfortunately it has been out of print for many years. My local library (=the 20 libraries of Helsinki University) has many copies, but it is one of the largest in Europe... In other words, it might be very hard to find. If you live in university town you might be lucky. It is definitely worth trying to get if your interested in Irish dialects, in Munster Irish or just in speaking natural Irish.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Maidhc Ó G. (67.235.185.91 - 67.235.185.91)
Posted on Friday, November 07, 2003 - 11:45 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, a chara,
GRMMA for the info and the link. It looks very fascinating, and though, I'm still awaiting reply from that publisher on the availability of that work, I've found another publisher who is able to procure it for me. I will be getting a copy.
Arís, a chara, GRMMA!
-Maidhc.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Marilyn Driscoll (142.139.1.68 - 142.139.1.68)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 12:13 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I too am just beginning to learn Irish. My husband and I have taken two trips in the last three years to the home of his ancestors in the Baltimore, Cape Clear Island area of County Cork. They do have an active Irish language school in Cape Clear but they also offer on-line courses in Munster Irish for beginners at the following site:
http://www.gaeltalk.net

Have any of you heard how good this course is or any other comments? I wouldn't mind some feedback before I put out the money to take it. Thanks
- Marilyn

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.178.152 - 213.243.178.152)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 12:37 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Marilyn!

Already by looking at your name the connection to the area was obvious. Oileán Chléire (Cape Clear Island) is THE stronghold for the Driscoll family.

I guess I would have loved http://www.gaeltalk.net when I first started to learn Irish but it wasn't around back then. By the time it was established I already spoke more or less fluent Irish (and Munster Irish to that, the dialect of Oileán Chléire) so I never considered paying for a beginners' course in something that I've used in my daily life for years. This means that I can't say anything of the content of the site other than that I've looked at parts of it and I think it looks great.

What I can say is that I know the man behind the project, and whatever he puts his name into is worth considering. He has started up a number of companies in Irish-speaking regions, amongst them the best Irish bookshop http:/www.litriocht.net in the Corca Dhuibhne Gaeltacht and the firm http://www.bardnangleann.com and now Gaeltalk. In my view he is an unsung hero, he is providing both employment and pride in the language in the Irish-speaking areas, the two things that are most needed.

My advice, as a fluent Irish speaker, is that you give http://www.gaeltalk.net a try, I very much doubt that you'll be disappointed. If you would be, please say so here at daltaí and I'll contact the manager and forward any complaint you may have. I don't think that will be necessary, though, so I would also like to hear from you if you are happy with Gaeltalk. The really good thing with it is that not only are you learning Irish from a native speaker, you are also doing something for the survival of the language. There is no alternative I could praise higher. By the way, once you have a bit of Irish I'm sure you'll be interested in this book:
http://www.litriocht.com/book.cfm?id=3801
(I have it myself and I love it)


Slán go fóill,
Jonas

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Seosamh Mac Muirí (193.1.100.104 - 193.1.100.104)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 01:16 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Marilyn a chara,

I can second the professionalism behind the Gaeltalk course having known one of those involved, Dorothee Uí Cheallaigh, in university, NUIG, then UCG, in the late eighties. Is maith liom go mór suíomh Gaeltalk - I really like their site.
Articles, in Irish, and screen savers from Cléire ar online, free at Beo.ie. You may look here: http://www.beo.ie/2003-09/liz_seal.asp

As Jonas commented, your husband's background almost demands that you take up with Cléire.
Get stuck in and enjoy it!

Good luck with it - Go n-éirí sé leat.

Seosamh

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Bradford (216.16.15.66 - 216.16.15.66)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 01:56 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas nó Seosamh,

Any idea of whether or not Gaeltalk has plans to eventually branch out beyond Munster Irish? I'd love to have access to a native speaker, but I think I'd personally prefer a Aran Islander. :)

Go raibh maith agaibh.

- Bradford

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.178.152 - 213.243.178.152)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 02:17 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Bradford, a chara

I have no idea. I know that the man behin all these projects would love to establish some sort of business to help every Gaeltacht. There are two reasons why I don't think there will be any Aran extension in the near future:

1. He loves Munster, and the Gaeltacht areas of Uíbh Rathach and An Rinn are still lacking any of his services.

2. (This is a positive reason!!) The language is exceptionally strong on the Aran Islands, so the need isn't as strong there, buíochas le Dia. I've met people with very little English on Inis Meáin, and that is something that can't be said about Munster.

However, if you are looking for some help on Aran Irish: after some twenty visits to the Aran Islands, including working as a tourist guide there, I do feel I know the dialect pretty well. I'd love to answer any questions. After the Irish of Corca Dhuibhne and the Irish of Garmna (places where I've spent very long periods) there is hardly any dialect or area that I know better.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Bradford (216.16.15.66 - 216.16.15.66)
Posted on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 04:02 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, a chara,

Thank you for offering to answer any questions I might have about Aran Irish. I don't have any now but some are certain to pop up sooner or later!

And good on the man that helps establish these businesses in the Gaeltachtaí. He certainly is a blessing.

- Bradford

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James (199.112.55.122 - 199.112.55.122)
Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2003 - 12:12 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, A Chara:

Is lodging available on Inis Meáin? What little Irish I have is academic in nature only. I have never been able to immerse myself in it from a practical standpoint. I would LOVE to spend a week or two on Inis Meáin, or in any other Cois Fhairrage speaking part of Ireland. I firmly believe that the only way to ever truly learn any language is by immersion. Unfortunately, that is becoming less and less of an option with Irish. It sounds like Inis Meáin might be the exception.

Interested in any advice, input or other guidance you would have in this regard.

Ard Mheas,

James

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Aonghus (62.77.191.130 - 62.77.191.130)
Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2003 - 04:13 am:   Edit Post Print Post


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James (199.112.55.122 - 199.112.55.122)
Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2003 - 04:31 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Aonghus, A Chara:

Go raibh mile maith agat! That's exactly what I was looking for...plus there's a link for adults wanting to study An Gaeilge in the Galway region.

Maith thú, A Aonghuis!

Ard Mheas,

James

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jonas (213.243.190.52 - 213.243.190.52)
Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2003 - 05:02 am:   Edit Post Print Post

James, I guess the good link that Aonghus sent answers your question. Might I recommend that you don't go the guesthouse? (Depending on what you're looking for of course.) I know from own experience that guesthouses offer higher service but you rarely get to speak that much, not compared to staying in a good B&B.

I was somwhat surprised to see that the link for studying Irish in the region only contained one course. There are courses for adults on Inis Meáin as well, so it would make sense to include that course on a link from Inis Meáin, I guess ;-)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

James (199.112.55.122 - 199.112.55.122)
Posted on Thursday, November 13, 2003 - 05:29 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Jonas, A Chara:

The language link was for Áras Mháirtín Uí Chadhain, the Irish Language Acquisition and Maintenance Centre in Galway. I'm sure they can get me the information on Inis Meáin. I wholeheartedly concur regarding the B&B experience. My wife and I spent an amazing 5 days in the west with only one night (our last) in a hotel. The B&B is definitely the way to go!

Ard Mheas,

James

Add Your Message Here
Posting is currently disabled in this topic. Contact your discussion moderator for more information.


©Daltaí na Gaeilge