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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2003 (July-September) » Help with a name. « Previous Next »

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Austin (204.39.229.142 - 204.39.229.142)
Posted on Sunday, September 07, 2003 - 09:50 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Hello and good day. Pardon me, but I was hoping that someone here would take the time to help me with the pronounciation of the name MacMiadhachain. I'd also appreciate any information on the meaning if it has one. I know this is a forum for the discussion of the Irish language and not really the place for surname questions, but I didn't have an idea of wherelse to ask. I'd appreciate any help at all, and I thank you greatly for your time.

Thanks again,
Austin

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Seosamh Mac Muirí (193.1.100.104 - 193.1.100.104)
Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 05:19 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Austin a chara,

This surname, Mac Miadhacháin, I would pronounce 'mock meehan', and also 'mock MEEhawin'.

It's modern transliterate form, 'Mac Meekin', is a 'pretrified' form and represents an earlier pronounciation. Locally however, in east Ulster one does hear 'Cackle' for 'Cahill', which may point to the possibility that a living Irish form of the surname in that area could perhaps still be rendered 'mock meekin'. Such can only be proved by running the name on peoples' lips in the area for a generation or so!

A modern Irish written form, for the sake of brevity/standardization would be Ó Miacháin.

The root 'miadhach', 'honourable' is found in other names, Ó Maoil Mhiadhaigh > Mulvey of Leitrim being one example. Similarly, the nominal diminutive termination/ending, 'án > áin' is very common. 'Ó' is a noun that meant 'grandchild' and of course in a permanent structure of a surname, or a tribal name, means 'offspring'.

Ádh mór.

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Austin (204.39.224.185 - 204.39.224.185)
Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 10:20 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Thank you very much for the information. The reason I was asking about this name is because of a possible connection with the name McMaken.

Thanks again
Austin

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Seosamh Mac Muirí (193.1.100.104 - 193.1.100.104)
Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 11:33 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Tá fáilte romhat 'Austin - You're welcome.
On the name that you mention, Mc Maken, you may be aware that Mac Maicín of Cos. Tyrone/Monaghan/Louth and Mac Miadhacháin of Cos. Antrim/Down are distinguished from each other etymologically, as is evident from the Irish spelling here.

That is to say,
Mac Maicín > Mac Maken,
while
Mac Miadhacháin > Mac Meekin.

Ádh mór,

Seosamh

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Austin (204.39.224.185 - 204.39.224.185)
Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 12:06 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Honestly, I had never heard or seen Mac Maicín before I read your post. I had associated McMaken with MacMiadhachain because I had assumed McMaken to be a variant of McMakin which I have seen connected with MacMiadhachain from a few different sources. This is interesting to me. I had read that the surnames Makmakyn, MacMakin, and McKmacken(along with a few others) were conndected to the Scottish name McMicking which had the gaelic of MacMiadhachain. So I was thinking McMaken was another variant, but I think I will have to look into this other name. Thanks for the information!

Austin

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Jonas (213.243.191.40 - 213.243.191.40)
Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 12:59 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Bail ó Dhia ort, a Sheosaimh, is iontach an t-eolas atá id cheannsa! Bhíos ag féachaint ar an gcómhra so ach níor aithníos an t-ainm "MacMiadhachain" in aon chor, ní chonac riamh é. Bheadh an áit seo thar a bheith níos gruamaí gan tusa; is féidir leat gach ceist a fhreagairt go gearr ach, san am céanna, go fairsing agus is tallann mhór í sin.

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Seosamh Mac Muirí (193.1.100.104 - 193.1.100.104)
Posted on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 07:10 am:   Edit Post Print Post

Dia duit a Austin.

Yes, personal nomenclature, when engaged in the spoiling of two or more languages, can be a winding road. I avoided complicating the explanation in the last post with mention of Mac Mahon and Mac Cann occasionally submerging forms of Mac Maicín in the Monaghan region. I consider myself lucky to have some sources at hand and to have had an interest in nomenclature for many years. Academia, with a few noble exceptions, left this field to the tourist trade. One academic source has to be mentioned: http://migration.ucc.ie/indexmedia.htm Sadly, this Ionad na hImirce is reportedly giving it's last gasp and is to be discontinued. I don't know who started it (a few departments are mentioned), or who is the driving force behind it, but it stands out as one of these noble efforts that gets shot down. Some stuff in the research, which evades me just now, is remarkable.

In contrast, an example of the tourist trade is, this week being national heritage week, if I am to avail of the free entry to a particular site, Parke's Castle on the north shore of Loch Gile, http://www.tumalo.com/castle.htm (the high land to the left behind the castle was my greatgrtgrtgrt-grandfather's!) I shall have to listen to a young guide completely mispronounce the name of the original builder on the site, a man who was hung in London in 1591, a man who deserves some respect. http://www.dnaco.net/~mobrien/irishptr/irepoems/brianoru.html
http://users.aber.ac.uk/infoman/welsh/exam2000/semester2/irm0430.html Until about 1430 my own family carried the surname Ó Ruairc and the man hung in London, Brian na Múrtha Ó Ruairc, was fifth in descent from a second cousin of the progenitor of my own surname. If the guide had Irish, he could pronounce the name, of one who deserves such, properly.

A Jonas, a chara,

Diolch yn fawr i chi am fyn nghorfoli (fhormholadh?) fel hynny. Nid yngh ym pen i ydy i'r gwybodaeth, ond mae llawr o lyfrau gen i yn y'r swyddfa yma. Maith dom an mílitriú óir is fada fada an lá ó bhíos ag spalpadh liom sa teanga sin. D'wi ddim wedi fod yn ymarfer fyng Ghymraeg i ers blynyddoedd. Hwyl am y tro.

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Seosamh Mac Muirí (193.1.100.104 - 193.1.100.104)
Posted on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 01:41 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Scothfhoinse Chorcaí i gceart anseo:

http://minerva.ucc.ie:6336/dynaweb/atlas/atlas/@Generic__BookView

Is fiú féachaint ar uimhir VI, 'Examples of Small Surnames ...'

Ádh mór.

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Austin (204.39.225.193 - 204.39.225.193)
Posted on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 03:50 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Thanks for the help and information!

Austin

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