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The Daltaí Boards » Archive: 1999-2004 » 2002 (July-December) » Pronunciation « Previous Next »

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Elewyn (1cust69.tnt5.kennewick.wa.da.uu.net - 65.239.90.69)
Posted on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 12:53 am:   Edit Post Print Post

I'm trying to figure out how to pronounce something and there's a bunch of Long Words that I can chop up but I'm still not sure about.. I'd rather be sure than wrong. I have the English translation, but it seems like some are compound words, so if you can chop them up and explain what each bit contributes, I'd be forever in your debt.

Here they are:
chomhairle
ghóthaigh
gealgháireach
flaitheas
buanseamhach
suthain

This is all so far, but I'm working down the paragraphs, so I'll be back with more.

Go raibh míle maith agat,
Elewyn

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Seosamh Mac Bhloscaidh (1cust148.tnt12.nyc9.da.uu.net - 67.192.250.148)
Posted on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 04:25 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

chomhairle - /ko:rl'@ (The slash indicates that emphasis is on the first syllable; the apostrophe that the 'l' is slender; the @ that it is pronounced as a shwa) or in rough transliteration: KOAR-luh It means advice

ghóthaigh - I think you meant to write "ghnóthaigh" (gained, earned, worked): /gno:hi: (GHNOA-hee) (the gh is a voiced gutteral sound, not the plain, hard 'g' we are used to in English.

gealgháireach -- /g'alga:r@kh (GYAL-GHAWR-ukh)sunny, joyous, cheerful

flaitheas -- /flah@s (FLAH-hus) paradise

buanseamhach -- /bu:@nshasw@kh (BOO-UN-shas-wukh) steadfast, permanent

suthain -- /suh@n (SUH-huhn) perpetual

You should get the Foclóir Póca (Pocket Dictionary). It gives pronunciation for all the Irish entries. You can also get a tape and booklet that were produced in conjunction with the dictionary and treats basic Irish pronunciation.

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Seosamh Mac Bhloscaidh (1cust148.tnt12.nyc9.da.uu.net - 67.192.250.148)
Posted on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 04:28 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Please ignore the bold in my attempt to give a semitechnical pronunciation. It doesn't mean anything except that the system decided they are Internet links.

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Elewyn (1cust214.tnt5.kennewick.wa.da.uu.net - 65.239.90.214)
Posted on Monday, July 08, 2002 - 06:22 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Yes, oops, and the h looks enough like an n that I didn't catch it. It's gnóthaigh, so it's still the hard g... (correct me if I'm wrong..) and in buanseamhach, there's only one s, so how does it get the second s sound? Hmmm... and buanseamhach doesn't follow the slender/slender broad/broad rule, is that a typo, or because it's made from two words, or what? I could easily have made a mistake copying.

I have one Irish dictionary, but I got it so early on that I was thrilled to even find one and I didn't know to look for pronunciation. Oops, again. I plan on searching the local bookstores when I get the chance... I hope I'm not bothering people meanwhile... your help was wonderful, thanks!

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Seosamh Mac Bhloscaidh (1cust180.tnt13.nyc9.da.uu.net - 67.192.236.180)
Posted on Tuesday, July 09, 2002 - 02:35 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

I didn't even notice that the second 's' was missing from 'buanseasmhach'. It's a broad 's', pronounced like the the English 's' in 'sat'.

A broad 'g' is pronounced like a hard 'g' in English, often with a 'w' like glide following it (but not in the case of gnóthaigh -- with a following consonant it would be too difficult). When a broad 'g' is lenited (indicated by an 'h' in writing), it is pronounced like the the 'ch' in Scottish 'loch' or German 'Achtung!', but it is voiced. In other words, it will start in the throat as the 'ch' sound I described, but you will not allow it to come up -- keep it down there! If done properly it will sound much more like a 'g' than a 'c' or 'ch' or whatever.

I know the feeling about the dictionary. The two best dictionaries to have are the Foclóir Póca -- especially for beginners and intermediates, because it has a correct pronunciation for each word. (It may not be the right pronunciation for the dialect you choose to learn, but you can always refine what you have learned from "correct" to "more correct".)

The second acquisition you will probably make is the Foclóir Gaeilge-Béarla, Niall Ó Dónaill, ed. That's the standard Irish-English dictionary. The older Dinneen Irish-English Dictionary is a must for people who go the whole way -- or even half the way. Two newer dictionaries that are also worth getting are the Oxford and Collins English-Irish, Irish-English dictionaries.

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Elewyn (1cust67.tnt5.kennewick.wa.da.uu.net - 65.239.90.67)
Posted on Wednesday, July 10, 2002 - 03:29 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Mostly what I need is the word-as-a-whole pronunciation... what I have problems with is mostly vowels and vowel combinations. The gh/ch comparison was very helpful, though... they're both kinda tricky.. mostly the farthest I get is h. And I read somewhere that the (I think slender?) r is rolled.. I've never been able to roll Rs, though.. and going into 3rd year Spanish.. I bet I'll learn! I think I'm probably just shy, even mumbling it to myself.

I have the Collins E-I I-E dictionary.. it's little and cute.. I was quite happy when I found it, in a college bookstore. We were on an orchestra trip, almost a year and a half ago. Did you know that most people don't read dictionaries? I thought this rather strange... hmmm... I was flipping through it all the way home. *smilesmile*

So.. I've been at this long enough to know most of the consonants and etc, although if there's something tricky and you feel like describing it, it's very helpful.. feel free to just put the non-technical pronunciation, because I have a longish list of them and I don't want to take up too much of your time.. it's the more helpful anyways. If there's something like.. in gealgháireach, where geal is a word, but I don't know about the rest, or chomhairle, with a tonnn of words starting with chomh-, and you know what the other word bits add to it, or whatever, *and* you know it off the top of your head, I'd love to know those.

Go raibh míle maith agat,
Elewyn

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Elewyn (1cust67.tnt5.kennewick.wa.da.uu.net - 65.239.90.67)
Posted on Wednesday, July 10, 2002 - 03:40 pm:   Edit Post Print Post

Oh yes, and I was meaning to add- in gnóthaigh, I either almost skip right past the g or add a slight vowel between them, which makes it one more syllable than you have up there, or there's also other examples where it turns into an r sometimes, mná I think is one? Unless I got the accent wrong. Which is it, or do I just need practice?

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